Epsom Oaks and Derby

Discuss racing outside the USA.

Moderators: Roguelet, WaveMaster, K~2, Jorge

Carlo Algatrensig
2yo Maiden
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon Jun 02, 2008 2:55 pm
Location: Birmingham, England
Contact:

Epsom Oaks and Derby

Postby Carlo Algatrensig » Thu Jun 03, 2010 3:40 am

Anyone have any opinions on these races.

My 2 picks are Aviate in the Oaks and Midas Touch in the Derby.

Also I'm hugely disappointed that St Nicholas Abbey didn't make it to the race.
"Best Mate is a Villa fan"

erins isle
Grade III Winner
Posts: 1121
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2004 6:26 am
Location: The basement of Europe

Postby erins isle » Sat Jun 05, 2010 7:32 am

Hi Carlo,

I totally agree with you about St Nicholas Abbey. The Derby is more open than ever. My husband does like the way Jan Vermeer moves (he is called after Dutch painter Johannes Vermeer however).

Parlo: how great the ex German Filly won this race Epsom by Platini!! (she looks like Mellanie a lot)

http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-ra ... 25353/top/

be back soon, have to watch BBC now!!
The more I get to know people, the more I love animals.

User avatar
dublino
Grade I Winner
Posts: 1595
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 8:54 am

Postby dublino » Sat Jun 05, 2010 8:42 am

What a race in the end, thought this was going to be a so so Derby after all the winter hype over St Nicolas Abbey.

What would have we seen if Workforce had made the 2000 Guineas?

Another Sea the Stars? Better maybe?
A new track record at Epsom running the Derby in nearly 2 secs quicker than Galileo.

We are really starting to see a shift in Pedigree of the top horses now in Europe the Mr Prospector blood is starting to come into play over all the Northern Dancer pedigrees.

Carlo Algatrensig
2yo Maiden
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon Jun 02, 2008 2:55 pm
Location: Birmingham, England
Contact:

Postby Carlo Algatrensig » Sat Jun 05, 2010 8:52 am

Fantastic performance by Workforce.

I thought At First Sight may have gotten to far away from the field at one point but it was a stunning performance to catch him and then beat him by 7 lengths.

To follow on Dublino about a possible shift in sire lines in europe I think this was the first time a Mr Prospector line stallion has sired the winner of the Derby
"Best Mate is a Villa fan"

User avatar
dublino
Grade I Winner
Posts: 1595
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 8:54 am

Postby dublino » Sun Jun 06, 2010 2:45 am

And Makfi, by Dubawi winning the 2000 Guineas classic double.
I doubt the Mr Prospector line will get the St Ledger :lol:

The European pedigrees are full of stamina and Northern Dancer.
Speed injection is what is needed.

You can see this with the Aga Khan also, he is using Pivotal, Oasis Dream and Invincible spirit to inject speed into his mares.

Can't understand why Coolmore haven't gone down the road of getting some Mr Prospector line stallions, heck they even let ARCHIPENKO
go he has such a stallions pedigree, possibly too much Northern Dancer in there already.....

parlo
Grade I Winner
Posts: 1515
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 9:36 am
Location: Germany

Postby parlo » Sun Jun 06, 2010 3:28 am

dublino wrote:... I doubt the Mr Prospector line will get the St Leger :lol: ....


You across the pond overestimate the Doncaster St. Leger in modern European racing. :!: :) The Triple Crown bears no value any more. :cry:

For a top-class 3yo there are more important races to gain more fame and glory (Irish Derby, King George VI & Queen Elizabeth Stk., Arc).

Carlo Algatrensig
2yo Maiden
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon Jun 02, 2008 2:55 pm
Location: Birmingham, England
Contact:

Postby Carlo Algatrensig » Sun Jun 06, 2010 4:46 am

dublino wrote:I doubt the Mr Prospector line will get the St Ledger :lol:


There has already been one.

Rule of Law won the 2004 St Leger and he's by Kingmambo

So certainly not a complete impossibility that a Mr P line horse will win it this year.
"Best Mate is a Villa fan"

User avatar
dublino
Grade I Winner
Posts: 1595
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 8:54 am

Postby dublino » Sun Jun 06, 2010 8:06 am

Carlo Algatrensig wrote:
dublino wrote:I doubt the Mr Prospector line will get the St Ledger :lol:


There has already been one.

Rule of Law won the 2004 St Leger and he's by Kingmambo

So certainly not a complete impossibility that a Mr P line horse will win it this year.


I stand corrected. :)

And Lope De Vegas win at Chantilly in the French Derby today, check out his close inbreeding to Machevellian as son of Mr P.

parlo
Grade I Winner
Posts: 1515
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 9:36 am
Location: Germany

Postby parlo » Sun Jun 06, 2010 12:40 pm

And here is the Chantilly-race - just another German-bred winner: :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDBRC-dXI9k


... inspite of 12 out of 16 male lines to Phalaris.

Mickey the Marcher
2yo Maiden
Posts: 96
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:47 pm

Postby Mickey the Marcher » Sun Jun 06, 2010 2:13 pm

parlo wrote:And here is the Chantilly-race - just another German-bred winner: :D

.


I believe you mean "bred by a German". Unless I missed the German invasion and annexation of Ireland.

erins isle
Grade III Winner
Posts: 1121
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2004 6:26 am
Location: The basement of Europe

Postby erins isle » Mon Jun 07, 2010 12:07 am

Several years ago the distance of the French Derby was brought back to 2100 meters, so this helps Mr Prospector line.

The winner Lope de Vega has lots of class, but is rather difficult to manage according to the stories - to much Phalaris -
The more I get to know people, the more I love animals.

parlo
Grade I Winner
Posts: 1515
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 9:36 am
Location: Germany

Postby parlo » Mon Jun 07, 2010 12:29 am

Mickey the Marcher wrote:I believe you mean "bred by a German". ...


Yes, that's right! Lope de Vega was raised in Ireland not in Bavaria. :wink:


:idea: Correction: LdV was raised in Bavaria from his 3-month-age. He was born in IRE, because mother visited Hurricane Run,