Kitten's Joy

Discussion and analysis of thoroughbred stallions.

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kimberley mine
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Postby kimberley mine » Sat Oct 12, 2013 6:20 pm

And now Kitten's Dumplings wins a Gr-1, making her his 6th Gr-1 winner this year.

Add Grand Slam to the list of hot crosses for Kitten's Joy. Two Gr-1 winners and a Gr-3 winner this year, out of four different Grand Slam mares.

That gives KJ 9.5% stakes winners from foals (!) for horses older than 2. He's sitting at 12% stakes winners from starters, for horses older than 2.

In this one astounding season alone, the Ramseys have won well over $4 million in purses from their army of kittens. Mind-blowing results, from useful but not world-beating mares. He's currently at the top of the earnings list without a single TC trail race winner, Dubai winner, or big horse in Japan.

Even though Galileo is top of the heap in Europe, I would not be surprised to see some of the major Euro breeders sending mares to him, nor seeing them buying quality mares in foal to Kitten's Joy.

EDIT TO ADD: Dr. Fong mares are a no-brainer pedigree-wise. Son of Kris S, out of a Miswaki mare (Buckpasser), 2nd dam is by a son of Ciboulette.

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Quality Kitten

Postby hpkingjr » Sat Oct 19, 2013 1:14 am

Quality Kitten won a maiden race in Lexington today. When I checked her pedigree, she was 3x3 Lear Fan so also inbred to Roberto. When I checked the data base there were eleven other Kittens Joy foals inbred to Lear Fan. One stakes winner of the twelve .
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Postby Patuxet » Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:33 am

An aptly humorous summation:

The Year of the Kitten: “Ken Ramsey seems to be running an assembly line as much as a horse racing stable. He churns out these horses as if they're made in a factory somewhere, each one similarly named, each one with ability, so many of them stakes winners.” Bill Finley, ESPN
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Postby kimberley mine » Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:32 am

Another pattern starting to shape up....

Ide is a solid sire of racehorses in Louisiana but not who you might have picked as the broodmare sire of a really good turf horse. Grand Slam was also a solid sire of racehorses, but again, not whose daughters I would have guessed would turn out a hot cross with a longer-running turf stallion.

Aside from Mr. Prospector, they both carry the mare Key Bridge (Princequillo out of a Blue Larkspur mare), Grand Slam via Key to the Mint and Ide via Key to Content. She's bred very similarly to Prince John, who is by Princequillo out of a mare whose broodmare sire is Blue Larkspur.

So, who else has that bloodline? Swain, for one, and as best as I can tell, although he has no SW out of Swain mares, all of the starters out of Swain mares are winners. Some are cheap but he had a 2yo of 2013 break his maiden in a 7fT race at Belmont not long ago. Edit: 100% starters for 3yo and up, 90% winners out of Swain mares, including a very useful gelding who has run up $116k at the AOC level. Of his 3 2yos of 2013, 2 have started, one winner, one knocking on the door.

Tabasco Cat has Key to the Mint via Sauce Boat. Again, while they're not stakes horses, 2 winners out of 2 foals from Tabasco Cat mares.

One to watch:

Cabo Cat, the 2yo of 2013 mentioned above, won an $80,000 MSW at Belmont by 8 lengths on October 2nd after hitting traffic every which way but up. Winning time was 1:23.24.

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Postby kimberley mine » Sun Oct 20, 2013 1:28 pm

Added to the Key Bridge list:

The Salt Lake mare Steaming Home (dam by Key to the Mint) has three foals by Kitten's Joy. One is a 2yo of 2013 (who isn't showing up in Equibase) and the other two are both multiple winners of over $75,000. Both claimers, started out in the mid-level ranks and have dropped down, but still running and winning.

Excluding Grand Slam, that's 8 winners from 9 foals age 3yo+ who have Key Bridge on the page. With Grand Slam it's a bit more mixed--more foals, but more SW by a long shot.

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Postby Patuxet » Wed Oct 23, 2013 9:16 am

Here's the link to the Bill Finley article:

http://espn.go.com/horse-racing/story/_ ... ear-kitten

A host of cinematic elements in this story: Ken Ramsey saving the dam of Kitten's Joy from being put down as a race horse; she has trouble foaling and Kitten's Joy is delivered via C-section; Mrs. Ramsey cheering in a wheelchair.
"He is pure air and fire and the dull elements of earth and water never appear in him; he is indeed a horse ..." Wm. Shakespeare - Henry V

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Postby Cree » Sun Feb 16, 2014 12:15 pm

How does he look as a broodmare sire? The way they've handled him, with mares that weren't exactly of the "highest" class of racehorses (breeding him to mares that nick well, or physically fit him well), to get runners, I wonder how that will look as a broodmare sire in the future.

Opinions?

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Postby kimberley mine » Tue Feb 18, 2014 12:55 am

Cree wrote:How does he look as a broodmare sire? The way they've handled him, with mares that weren't exactly of the "highest" class of racehorses (breeding him to mares that nick well, or physically fit him well), to get runners, I wonder how that will look as a broodmare sire in the future.

Opinions?


Maybe better than it might appear at first blush.

He's an overall upgrader AND 1 out of every 10 of his foals has black type. He's sitting on 10% stakes winners from foals for his 3yo+ runners. The ones that don't run in stakes tend to run sound and well and pay their bills. On top of that, plenty of the better ones in his first crops may not look perfect on a page but they were out of useful running mares from profitable running families.

Case in point: http://www.pedigreequery.com/caterette

That mare is out of a good Phipps family, well-bred, didn't run well herself but has a stakes-winning half sister. She's produced two listed winning, GSP foals plus a third GSP foal by KJ. There is one filly in there, who is SW/GSP and ran out almost $200k. She's a huge upgrade on her dam and should produce that on.

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Postby da hossman » Wed Feb 19, 2014 9:53 am

Seems like the easy play would be to use any mare carrying Roberto or Ribot (found in Grand Slam, Ide, Tabasco Cat, etc). The old Darby Dan classic blood remains strong, even when it is less than obvious.
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Re:

Postby kimberley mine » Mon Jun 30, 2014 4:26 pm

kimberley mine wrote:One to watch:

Cabo Cat, the 2yo of 2013 mentioned above, won an $80,000 MSW at Belmont by 8 lengths on October 2nd after hitting traffic every which way but up. Winning time was 1:23.24.


Cabo Cat won the Penn Mile on Saturday. First SW out of a Swain mare.

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Re: Kitten's Joy

Postby jellac » Fri Jul 04, 2014 8:27 am

The Ramseys and their Kitten's Joy have shown how a plan to carefully and properly support/manage a stallion's initial seasons - backed by their financial resources and no small amount of resolve can give a talented racehorse whose 'style' of running doesn't fit the mainstream market a chance to prove himself worthy of consideration by the mainstream as a stud. When I think of the investment of time, as well as finances required for such a project to reach the stage of knowing whether Kitten's Joy was going to prove a top option among the many quality stallions in Kentucky available to breeders - and again the personal fortitude/resolve and deep personal commitment at every level that this Kitten's Joy venture required I have to salute a really singular effort in modern Thoroughbred breeding history. I loved watching Kitten's Joy when he raced, wondered if he would get a fair shake at stud in N.A. when he retired to the Breeding sheds and then wondered if his owners had the resolve to see this venture through the necessary years it would take to even know the answer. They have more than just risen to that formidable challenge - they have, in my book, re-defined what 'Owner/Breeder' can and should mean with regard to owning a proven racehorse, yet unproven stallion, and showing what it takes to give that beloved racehorse a real chance at proving himself at stud. This huge investment could have always gone the other way, but if it had, at least the Ramseys and the world would never have had to ask the question, 'but was he [Kitten's Joy] realistically ever given a fair chance to prove himself at stud?' That is a question/implication that I've seen raised over the many years of lurking/posting on the Board whenever an unproven stallion, early in his career, OR a 'proven' stallion is moved to regional breeding centers from Kentucky, etc. The Ramsey's had the resources to do it at the very top of the thoroughbred sport/breeding industry (and I'm not just talking about $$$ when I say resources) and they have done it. Most importantly they had the resolve and they had a plan and they saw it through to it's fruition - when success was anything but guaranteed. I am most impressed that Ken Ramsey garners the greatest 'pay back' from this not inconsequential enterprise from enjoying his wife's infectious enthusiasm while watching the offspring of Kitten's Joy race and - very often - win, at the top of this sport's racing venues/events. What a great story this has been............ and continues to be!!!!!

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Re: Kitten's Joy

Postby dublino » Mon Jul 07, 2014 1:28 am

This man could hold the key to the derby for the future he just needs to breed his Kittens to the right stallions.

Surprised he hasnt got a Mr P line stallion as yet for these mares.....
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kimberley mine
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Re: Kitten's Joy

Postby kimberley mine » Tue Jul 08, 2014 7:14 pm

Dub, between his physical, the line to Roberto, the line to Special, and his racing aptitude, I'd be very curious to see what happens with KJ daughters sent to Blame!

Given how well Lonhro has done with the Ciboulette family, KJ daughters with Lonhro are worth looking at.

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Re: Kitten's Joy

Postby dublino » Wed Jul 09, 2014 12:50 am

Yikes, Blame is my tip to be a bad stallion! :cry:

Does inbreeding to Roberto work that well?
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Re: Kitten's Joy

Postby kimberley mine » Wed Jul 09, 2014 8:08 pm

For Kitten's Joy, yes, Roberto has been a very important cross.

What about Blame makes you think he's the next big flop?

Edit to add:

Steaming Kitten, the foal out of the Salt Lake mare whose 3rd dam is by Key to the Mint, is now a Gr-3 winner in Italy. He RNA'd for $95,000 as a yearling and has earned $150,000 this year.