Pedigree research source?

vineyridge · Grade III Winner Joined: 28 Jan 2005 Posts: 1134

Is there a sires equivalent of the APR?

Is the GSB on CD?

Where does one go to search for South American pedigrees?
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Pan Zareta · Posted: Sun Nov 28, 2010 4:35 pm Post subject:

There's no single comprehensive reference by sire that's a 100% analogue of the APR. BRIS' yearly 'Sire Stats' & the stallion registers may be as close as it gets.

As far as I know the GSB is not available on CD.

There's no central registry for South America. Each country maintains its own. A few have some records available online. These are largely limited to breeding stock in service at and after the advent of the ISBC (mid 70's). Earlier records are difficult to find. The Argentine stud books are probably "easiest", but I know of only one complete set in North Am and it's in a private library. Lucy may have more, and better, links.

http://www.studbook.com.uy/
http://www.studbook.com.br/
http://www.clubhipico.cl/index2.htm#inicio
http://www.studbook.com.ar/

vineyridge · Grade III Winner Joined: 28 Jan 2005 Posts: 1134

Just suppose I was looking for lineal descendants of Bubbles or Guersant anywhere in the world.

What sort of references would I need to do that?
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Pan Zareta · Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 4:15 pm Post subject:

xfactor fan · Breeder's Cup Winner Joined: 16 Sep 2004 Posts: 2186

I've been meaning to ask this for a while. The big study on equine Y chromosomes showed three almost identical Y's in the TB. Did they ever name the horses in the study? Or could the info be sweet talked out of someone?

Given that three variation were found, how cool would it be to have one each in the founding sirelines. Just a dream, but wouldn't it be nice to be able to sort out some of the tangled pedigree lines.

Pan Zareta · Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 11:50 pm Post subject:

xfactor fan · Breeder's Cup Winner Joined: 16 Sep 2004 Posts: 2186

Pan Zaretta, this is your post from 2009. I read the paper, and thought it indicated that they found 3 kinds of Y's in the TB, that differed only slightly.

A doctoral dissertaion submitted 12/2004 at TAMU sampled a variety of domestic horse breeds, including the TB, and found one point of segregation on the Y chromosome, MS(microsatellite)30 at which 3 y-specific (MS30 has an analogue on the X chrom.) alleles were found. Full text in pdf for can be found Arrow here. Implications for pedigree research - and sire line mythology Twisted Evil - are unknown. Meaningless or not, sire line reverence lives on. The AQHA will probably approve registration of clones soon, regardless of the fact that it isn't a true clone unless the mtDNA of the host ovum is identical to that of the cloned individual. But clones would never be registered if that was the y chromosome being changed out. Shocked Why....it wouldn't be an Own Son of Old So 'n So!! Rolling Eyes

Diomed, most sources agree that Herod exerts the single greatest genetic influence on the contemporary TB.

Xfactor fan, I enjoyed that article about GK too. Wasn't there a map in which you could pretty much track his path across Asia by presence of a certain yDNA haplotype in the contemporary population?

Pan Zareta · Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 1:02 pm Post subject:

My bad. That could definitely use some clarification....

This microsatellite(MS) is on the X and Y chromosomes (may recombine in females, but not males). Five alleles at that site are documented in the dissertation. At least three of these were found on the Y, but in samples with two alleles it wasn't possible to tell which chromosome had which allele. At one point the author does refer to these three as "Y specific", suggestive that they occur only on the Y, but that's misleading. They also occur on the X since in some cases only one of those alleles was detected. (Actually 4 of the 5 alleles were found in 'single copy'. I'm not sure why the author didn't include that fourth allele among those that could be assigned to the Y.)

The population used for comparison at this MS within the domestic horse consisted of 33 samples from 14 breeds (Table 4). Two alleles were found in 2 of 4 samples from male TBs. Interestingly, multiple alleles were found within the domestic horse at several other Y chromosome MS's (Table 5) but there was no analysis of these by breed within the domestic horse.

As noted in the dissertation, mutations in microsatellite length occur more frequently than other types of mutation. Imo, they're the only ray of hope for ever distinguishing between TB sire lines via yDNA. This would be helpful to pedigree research - but it offers no substance or foundation for sire line mythology.

xfactor fan · Breeder's Cup Winner Joined: 16 Sep 2004 Posts: 2186

I'm not a sireline --several words come to mine--I"ll settle for fan. It would be nice to have something to sort out the tangle of male descent the way mtDNA works on the female lines.

But the question remains, is there any way to get the names of the horses in the study?

Pan Zareta · Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 3:49 pm Post subject: