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Mood Swings
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Joined: 27 Sep 2006
Posts: 1397
Location: Ontario, Canada
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 Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:52 am Post subject: Stallion suggestions for Phone Trick mare |
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I am considering sending my mare to Kentucky to be bred this year. If I had a lot of money to spend my first choice would be Speightstown. Unfortunately I do not have the $50k 
I breed to sell and I don't want to spend more then $20k.
I have an opportunity to breed to Stormy Atlantic (who I love) on a foal share, however I am not thrilled with his yearling average and considering that I have to split the sales proceeds with the stallion owner, pay the inflated board prices for at least 45 days, shipping and only be listed as co-breeder...I'm not sure I find this so enticing anymore.
My mare is She Ain't Much, she has a stakes winner by Omega Code, a winner by Montbrook, a placed filly by Vibank (Silver Deputy), a yearling by Where's The Ring (a very nice filly) and a foal by Old Forester (very correct). Her progeny excell as sprinters.
Appreciate any thoughts.
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Tappiano
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Joined: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 1095
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| Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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| If there were a stallion by Gone West out of a Danzig mare I'd suggest that one but I can't think of one off the top of my head. Or, one who is inbred to Danzig because both of those lines would love more War Admiral which is up close in your mares pedigree. If I think of any I'll update this. |
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kimberley mine
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Joined: 11 Jan 2005
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| Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:02 pm Post subject: Re: Stallion suggestions for Phone Trick mare |
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| Mood Swings wrote: | I am considering sending my mare to Kentucky to be bred this year. If I had a lot of money to spend my first choice would be Speightstown. Unfortunately I do not have the $50k
I breed to sell and I don't want to spend more then $20k.
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Are you planning on selling the foal as an Ontario-bred? The $10-$15k range is commercially tricky; either you're looking at somebody unproven or horses where the 2yos might sell BIG but not the yearlings or at somebody who is high-end breed to race and you MIGHT get lucky at the sales.
Safe bet: go to Quiet American NOW while you can still get him.
Riskier bet: Roman Ruler is poised for a big upswing: after Rule and Homeboykris, he went from a tiny 4th crop of about 20 to a better crop of about 83, and last year he bred a hundred or so of much better mares. If Ruler on Ice and Rule continue to run well this year, and some of his other horses step it up you could get a nice one. |
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ak1
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Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 412
Location: Missouri
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| Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Include or Proud Citizen, Holy Bull...like Kimberly's idea of Quiet American too. How does she match up physically? Does she require a particular physical type? |
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kimberley mine
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| Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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| ak1 wrote: | | Include or Proud Citizen, Holy Bull...like Kimberly's idea of Quiet American too. How does she match up physically? Does she require a particular physical type? |
Holy Bull's book is very light and tight due to his age. If she's not already booked and it's mid-April, I would pass on him.
Include is a great idea on paper...he has a stakes winner out of a Phone Trick mare and a Gr-1 winner out of a Mazel Trick mare. As a sire of racehorses, he's doing a great job. Stakes production is a little weak, but he gets good sound runners who make good money (see my reply on the post about a Take Me Out mare). Commercially he's at a crossroads, seems to have his star rising but how far is anybody's guess. |
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ak1
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Location: Missouri
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:05 am Post subject: |
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[quote="kimberley mine"] | ak1 wrote: |
Holy Bull's book is very light and tight due to his age. If she's not already booked and it's mid-April, I would pass on him. |
This makes me sad ...I know it's realistic but love him and think his fillies are pretty special additions for a broodmare band. Physically is he doing well? |
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kimberley mine
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:16 am Post subject: |
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[quote="ak1"] | kimberley mine wrote: | | ak1 wrote: |
Holy Bull's book is very light and tight due to his age. If she's not already booked and it's mid-April, I would pass on him. |
This makes me sad ...I know it's realistic but love him and think his fillies are pretty special additions for a broodmare band. Physically is he doing well? |
I have not heard of any health problems, just he's old. |
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Mood Swings
Grade II Winner
Joined: 27 Sep 2006
Posts: 1397
Location: Ontario, Canada
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 9:59 am Post subject: Re: Stallion suggestions for Phone Trick mare |
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| kimberley mine wrote: | | Mood Swings wrote: | I am considering sending my mare to Kentucky to be bred this year. If I had a lot of money to spend my first choice would be Speightstown. Unfortunately I do not have the $50k
I breed to sell and I don't want to spend more then $20k.
|
Are you planning on selling the foal as an Ontario-bred? The $10-$15k range is commercially tricky; either you're looking at somebody unproven or horses where the 2yos might sell BIG but not the yearlings or at somebody who is high-end breed to race and you MIGHT get lucky at the sales.
Safe bet: go to Quiet American NOW while you can still get him.
Riskier bet: Roman Ruler is poised for a big upswing: after Rule and Homeboykris, he went from a tiny 4th crop of about 20 to a better crop of about 83, and last year he bred a hundred or so of much better mares. If Ruler on Ice and Rule continue to run well this year, and some of his other horses step it up you could get a nice one. |
In answer to your question - yes I will foal her in Ontario to have the foal as a registered Ontario-bred. But being by a KY stallion opens up my options as to where I can sell. I do like Roman Ruler and have seen a number of them, I am also a fan of his half brother. Quiet American is good one too, but with his age a lot of people will look the other way come sales time...
I considered Haynesfield and Courageous Cat was suggested to me as well. Include looks interesting and I see he is throwing speed.
Thanks for the suggestions thus far 
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Mood Swings
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Joined: 27 Sep 2006
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Location: Ontario, Canada
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 10:24 am Post subject: |
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| ak1 wrote: | | Include or Proud Citizen, Holy Bull...like Kimberly's idea of Quiet American too. How does she match up physically? Does she require a particular physical type? |
I like that Proud Citizen has the Gone West sire line going for him, his yearling averages are not great, nor are Holy Bull's. Both are nice stallions though. I do like Include.
She is just 16hh, compact and correct. She throws a sprinter (so far that is true on paper) in physical appearance. I never saw the Montbrook filly but both of her Omega Codes are beefy sprinter types - like their sire. Her next two foals matured to the 16hh range (one of those is just a 2yr old) and they too have the look of sprinters. Her yearling is the tallest one she's had thus far and is by Where's The Ring (he's probably close to 16.2hh) and she still has the big engine that makes her look like a sprinter
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Tappiano
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Joined: 20 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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Holy Bull has a fantastic lifetime starters to foal ratio and his sales average is not bad either! I had thoroughly researched him and if it were not for his age would have sent my mare to him.
With your mare producing some crack sprinters I'd still look at Danzig, in my humble opinion. |
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ak1
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Location: Missouri
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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Looking at Danzig lines, Langfuhr, Belong to Me, and Partners Hero come to mind. Partners Hero would open up having a PA bred. Auction wise I think any of those will be best for two year olds in training. I thinks it would be rare to get a return at a yearling sale though Langfuhr certainly could intrigue at an Ontario sale.
If a second return of Clever Trick is not a turn off, perhaps Yes It's True? |
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Barcaldine
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Joined: 28 Jun 2011
Posts: 558
Location: KY
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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Take a look at MUNNINGS. He's by Speightstown out of a Holy Bull mare.
I've bred four mares to him--three in foal, one counting days. Very fertile.
This is a very handsome horse which sold at 2 for $1.7 million. He could run and Ashford may cut you a late season deal. |
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Joltman
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Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 1108
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="kimberley mine"] | ak1 wrote: | | kimberley mine wrote: | | ak1 wrote: |
Holy Bull's book is very light and tight due to his age. If she's not already booked and it's mid-April, I would pass on him. |
This makes me sad ...I know it's realistic but love him and think his fillies are pretty special additions for a broodmare band. Physically is he doing well? |
I have not heard of any health problems, just he's old. |
I saw him last fall, took a picture. Did not look good to me. He has injuries that make it hard for him to walk. Still at it though firing bullets and getting great care.
++++++++++++++
A couple that come to mind - War Front, Scatdaddy. Scatdaddy is just lighting it up and his fee will be solid for years, only will get better at the sales. War Front has Danzig going for him and also the MP cross through Fappiano which is all class - Claiborne will keep the sales value up. For a runner, my personal fave might be Lewis Michael - a ntr sprinter who could stretch out to classic distance. He's an A+ True Nick and you can get a season really to him very inexpensively. In Ontario, the turf abilities would be respected but he could run on anything.
Given that she is a Stakes producer, you may be able to work a deal even if the book is 'full'. If you find a stallion you really like, look up the season peddlers as there are some great deals out there.
jm
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kimberley mine
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Joltman wrote: | Scatdaddy is just lighting it up and his fee will be solid for years, only will get better at the sales.
jm |
I also thought Scat Daddy, although his listed fee is out of the OP's price range. If you can get to him within your budget, by all means do so. |
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Barcaldine
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Joined: 28 Jun 2011
Posts: 558
Location: KY
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Scat Daddy is full, and when Ashford says a stallion is full , you can bet that means over 200 mares. I was lucky to get one bred to him this year but couldnt get another mare (1/2 to G1 SW) approved when I applied in February. |
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