Hello Tinner,
I'm hopeful that those purchasing lone star will try to do some stuff with the breeders and owners in mind other than the slots again. (I pray!) The track is beautiful and in a good location, so let's hope some good stuff happens with the track.
Texas Thoroughbred Forum
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I think that the deal on Lone Star and confirmation of the Remington sale is positive. However, according to what I have read, they have only bought a minority interest since under Texas law the majority interest must belong to to a Texas resident? It will be interesting to see who that might be?
Any resolution for the future is probably positive. I think that the new interests might be open to some form of mutual support between the track and Texas horsemen. We still need someone to speak for us.
Bedouwia
Any resolution for the future is probably positive. I think that the new interests might be open to some form of mutual support between the track and Texas horsemen. We still need someone to speak for us.
Bedouwia
jrgators wrote:Not trying to stir the pot again on the sales results for Texas, but did anyone see the results from day 1 at Keenland?OMG WOW
Azeri's filly didn't even bring 7figures! No horse got 7 figures! 55% decline!
This is the biggest sale in our industry in the country. Well organized, well advertised, and the buyers are just shy of stealing horses!
So looking at their numbers, did our drop "really" show how poorly Tx is doing things?
Bill Clinton told the first President Bush something prolific....."It's the economy...."
I'm going to go home, grab a beer, and look at my horses and try to figure out how I'm going to survive this, but I'm a constant believer that things will get better!
We do have some bright news I believe, and that's the interest by the Indians for Lone Star! Hopefully, they'll get it, and will work on improving things for all concerned as we move forward.
Theo
Nobody is stealing horses. Horses have been over valued for years. Like the false real estate bubble burst - the horse industry has been in a false bubble for years. The best thing that can happen to the horse business is what is happening now. Someone who pays the ridiculous prices for yearlings is either stupid or has way too much money (or both). There is no logical way to make a horseracing business plan work with these inflated prices.
NO WAY ANY YEARLING PROSPECT IS WORTH A MILLION OR MORE. People who pay that are either feeding their own ego, false selling to market horses or complete fools who will soon be parted from their money. Like the $4.00 gas was due to traders and speculators. The price of yearlings is controled the same way. Those who make a living racing (except for the celeb trainers) are not participating in the charade.
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jrgators
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CNG, I lean with agreeing with you, but not totally.
The prices are always too high when you buy them, and too low when you sale them.
The market does defend some of the 7 figure prices offered for some animals. But what I'm speaking of primarily is the cost associated with breeding, raising and selling these guys.
You have a nice mare, you get a deal on a stud fee, and the foal is good. Well you would think that it's reasonable that by the name the unnamed yearling reaches the sale ring between the stud fees and all other expenses you have a boat load of money tied up into the foal to then get what for it?
I don't believe most breeders pay the advertised price on stud fees, but let's say you get a 25% cut. OK, so it cost you 40K and not 50K, then you have 2 and 1/2 years into the foal and you get an offer of 8500! If it's Theo, someone needs to call 911 because I just collapsed in distress! 
I would love to be a buyer right now, it may have been over inflated for years, but people are taking a killing on all levels my friend, not just the 7 figure horses.
I'm personally in very deep, and I'm nowhere near that level of some of those feeling sick at Keenland.
You should be able to get you stud fee back on these foals atleast, well one would think that, but heck that's not happening even. People are loosing their hides right now.
Not all make a ton of profit off of their foals, jsut keep this in mind.
Theo
The prices are always too high when you buy them, and too low when you sale them.
The market does defend some of the 7 figure prices offered for some animals. But what I'm speaking of primarily is the cost associated with breeding, raising and selling these guys.
You have a nice mare, you get a deal on a stud fee, and the foal is good. Well you would think that it's reasonable that by the name the unnamed yearling reaches the sale ring between the stud fees and all other expenses you have a boat load of money tied up into the foal to then get what for it?
I don't believe most breeders pay the advertised price on stud fees, but let's say you get a 25% cut. OK, so it cost you 40K and not 50K, then you have 2 and 1/2 years into the foal and you get an offer of 8500! If it's Theo, someone needs to call 911 because I just collapsed in distress!
I would love to be a buyer right now, it may have been over inflated for years, but people are taking a killing on all levels my friend, not just the 7 figure horses.
I'm personally in very deep, and I'm nowhere near that level of some of those feeling sick at Keenland.
You should be able to get you stud fee back on these foals atleast, well one would think that, but heck that's not happening even. People are loosing their hides right now.
Not all make a ton of profit off of their foals, jsut keep this in mind.
Theo
jrgators wrote:CNG, I lean with agreeing with you, but not totally.
The prices are always too high when you buy them, and too low when you sale them.
The market does defend some of the 7 figure prices offered for some animals. But what I'm speaking of primarily is the cost associated with breeding, raising and selling these guys.
You have a nice mare, you get a deal on a stud fee, and the foal is good. Well you would think that it's reasonable that by the name the unnamed yearling reaches the sale ring between the stud fees and all other expenses you have a boat load of money tied up into the foal to then get what for it?
I don't believe most breeders pay the advertised price on stud fees, but let's say you get a 25% cut. OK, so it cost you 40K and not 50K, then you have 2 and 1/2 years into the foal and you get an offer of 8500! If it's Theo, someone needs to call 911 because I just collapsed in distress!
I would love to be a buyer right now, it may have been over inflated for years, but people are taking a killing on all levels my friend, not just the 7 figure horses.
I'm personally in very deep, and I'm nowhere near that level of some of those feeling sick at Keenland.
You should be able to get you stud fee back on these foals atleast, well one would think that, but heck that's not happening even. People are loosing their hides right now.
Not all make a ton of profit off of their foals, jsut keep this in mind.
Theo
This happened 25 years ago when the oil and real estate bust came along. That with the tax reform act of 1986 caught me with my pants down. People sent me their papers rather than paying their board bill and stud fees. I gave a mare that had brought 20K a year before to a guy who turned her in with a jack (she raised a world champion running mule -damn!). Priced were false then and here we are, today, the same way.
CNG -- boy do you bring back some memories. Yes, it is an up and down world. Many are suffering at the moment, but some will no doubt also buy low now and come out on top later. It is perhaps the real name of the horse game. Dreams and dilusions. If you stay within your means (at whatever level that is) it is still more fun than the stock market.
Bedouwia
Bedouwia
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Strategic Maneuver
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“The Chickasaw Nation has very successful casinos,” said Jack Pratt, chairman of the Texas Gaming Association. “They certainly didn't buy this track just to run the ponies.”
A Chickasaw-owned company, Global Gaming Solutions LSP, is expected to buy Lone Star Park next month as part of a bankruptcy settlement involving the track's majority owner, Magna Entertainment Corp. of Canada.
The most dramatic change Chickasaw ownership of Lone Star is likely to bring to the casino debate in Texas is to alter the dynamics of the fight in the Legislature to amend the state Constitution to allow casino gambling.
The Chickasaw Nation has put more than $362,070 into state political races since 2006. But because of its Winstar Casino on the Texas border, the Chickasaws opposed expanded Texas gambling. With the purchase of Lone Star, the tribe likely will support casino-style gambling — at least at race tracks.
A Global Gaming spokeswoman said the company will support whatever horse owners at the track believe will make Lone Star successful.
A foot in both camps
One of the biggest stumbling blocks to passing casino legislation in recent years has been infighting between track owners and casino owners. Horse and dog track owners have wanted a law that allows slot machines at tracks but no destination resort casinos. The casino industry has wanted both. Now, there will be a major horse track owner with a foot in both camps.
Sam Houston's Hurwitz is another 'track owner' (or at least the support of allowing casino gambling at the tracks with an eye to later being able to get liscenses for off-track related las Vegas style 'resort-casino complexes with no track/horses.
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jrgators
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Wow,
Not a post from anyone in 5 days!
Well, I have do say once again something about the management staff of Retama Park.
I was there this past Saturday, and I felt like the horse running in California, All I can Say is Wow!!
What a great crowd, and an unbelievable job those guys are doing in promoting the track and drawing a very nice group of people. It was a mad house with the number of people, and I don't think the count of 7000 some odd people was correct. It was just a beautiful site to see!
I'd hope that everyone who reads this would take a day, and make the trip. What a thrill to hear and see thousands of people cheer when the horses come out of the gate in a 7 and 1/2 furlong maiden turf race! It's something you have to see to really appreciate.
I, as anyone who's read some of my past postings have been quite critical of the tracks here in Texas. Retama's staff is putting on a great show week after week.
The turf course is back up, and it looks good too.
Congrats to the connections of the Stallion stakes races ran there on Saturday too. Valid showed without a doubt why he's #1 in Texas. Personally, Oak Motte was the most impressive looking 2 year old colt I've seen in a very long time!
Theo
Not a post from anyone in 5 days!
Well, I have do say once again something about the management staff of Retama Park.
I was there this past Saturday, and I felt like the horse running in California, All I can Say is Wow!!
What a great crowd, and an unbelievable job those guys are doing in promoting the track and drawing a very nice group of people. It was a mad house with the number of people, and I don't think the count of 7000 some odd people was correct. It was just a beautiful site to see!
I'd hope that everyone who reads this would take a day, and make the trip. What a thrill to hear and see thousands of people cheer when the horses come out of the gate in a 7 and 1/2 furlong maiden turf race! It's something you have to see to really appreciate.
I, as anyone who's read some of my past postings have been quite critical of the tracks here in Texas. Retama's staff is putting on a great show week after week.
The turf course is back up, and it looks good too.
Congrats to the connections of the Stallion stakes races ran there on Saturday too. Valid showed without a doubt why he's #1 in Texas. Personally, Oak Motte was the most impressive looking 2 year old colt I've seen in a very long time!
Theo
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keyranch
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People seam to be waiting on the Lone Star decision so they can exhale. The possibility of Penn national or R D Hubbard, having control of the lead track is not reassuring.
Received a letter soliciting support for the lobbyist, as ususual it does not spell out the legislation or give us something to read. The similarity in the way the racing legislation has been presented and the national health care plans is uncanny. There is no support or protection for the Texas bred and we are supposed to blindly go off the cliff.
The TTA and HBPA should be sending out surveys to all the horsemen to find out what we will support. Surveys written to get honest answers and not just the desired answers. Change the breedback rule, solicit OTB's, account wagering, instant race, slots, and support the Texas horsemen first. The slots or nothing approach is doomed to fail just as it has the last ten years.
The article in the Houston paper giving more credence and hope for the slots or nothing agenda if the Chickasaw purchase Lone Star is written by someone first in the kool aide line. Do you not think that if there was a reasonable chance of getting slots passed the next session the price tag on Lone Star would be through the roof. The 27 mil would be covered in a couple of days at the most with the take for the tracks as the legislation was written the last go around. Every casino operation in the world would be all over that opportunity.
Received a letter soliciting support for the lobbyist, as ususual it does not spell out the legislation or give us something to read. The similarity in the way the racing legislation has been presented and the national health care plans is uncanny. There is no support or protection for the Texas bred and we are supposed to blindly go off the cliff.
The TTA and HBPA should be sending out surveys to all the horsemen to find out what we will support. Surveys written to get honest answers and not just the desired answers. Change the breedback rule, solicit OTB's, account wagering, instant race, slots, and support the Texas horsemen first. The slots or nothing approach is doomed to fail just as it has the last ten years.
The article in the Houston paper giving more credence and hope for the slots or nothing agenda if the Chickasaw purchase Lone Star is written by someone first in the kool aide line. Do you not think that if there was a reasonable chance of getting slots passed the next session the price tag on Lone Star would be through the roof. The 27 mil would be covered in a couple of days at the most with the take for the tracks as the legislation was written the last go around. Every casino operation in the world would be all over that opportunity.
I have been off line for awhile due to the flu -- nasty stuff. I too got the request for support for our lobbyists. Not likely to support the same bunch that have such a poor track record. I will save my contributions for candidates who might listen to the people in the next session.
In the meantime, life goes on. Horses are running and some are winning. The TTA is still sending us small checks. My filly has been gone to what I call "boarding school" for a month now. She got a good report card this week. I expect that there will still be racing somewhere when she is ready?
Bedouwia
In the meantime, life goes on. Horses are running and some are winning. The TTA is still sending us small checks. My filly has been gone to what I call "boarding school" for a month now. She got a good report card this week. I expect that there will still be racing somewhere when she is ready?
Bedouwia
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keyranch
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It appears the Lone Star deal has moved forward for the Chickasaws. The next step will be the Texas partners they come up with. It appears to be someone everyone will be familiar with and will support. You have to keep in mind that the nation is always concerned with how they are perceived by the general public, and they will do their best to maintain that. It is a shame that the horsemens associations have such a poor reputation and image to the general horsemen. I do not see them having the kind of relationship with lonestar to help move things forward.
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Strategic Maneuver
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keyranch wrote:It appears the Lone Star deal has moved forward for the Chickasaws. The next step will be the Texas partners they come up with. It appears to be someone everyone will be familiar with and will support. You have to keep in mind that the nation is always concerned with how they are perceived by the general public, and they will do their best to maintain that. It is a shame that the horsemens associations have such a poor reputation and image to the general horsemen. I do not see them having the kind of relationship with lonestar to help move things forward.
Who do you think the Tx partners will be?
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keyranch
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It is not time to put it on the web. My Okie connections may not appreciate that. It is not a matter of money for the tribe, it is a matter of perception and confidence. Remember the 27 mil is not anywhere close to one days net in the Oklahoma casinos.
If it comes to pass as rumored, then everyone will be pleased from both sides of the red river.
It is our only hope that the political agenda in Texas can change from the slots or nothing crowd. There has been so much money left on the table by not having alternative revenue streams for purses that it is unbelievable. To continue to let our racing futures lie in the hands of a few self centered individuals is killing the industry from the ground up.
If it comes to pass as rumored, then everyone will be pleased from both sides of the red river.
It is our only hope that the political agenda in Texas can change from the slots or nothing crowd. There has been so much money left on the table by not having alternative revenue streams for purses that it is unbelievable. To continue to let our racing futures lie in the hands of a few self centered individuals is killing the industry from the ground up.