I have an area outside of my stalls that does not get direct sun and the mud never seems to dry. It is too thick and I want to fix the area. I was thinking of taking off the topsoil and putting down stone dust. Will that work? Also, wondering if there are any other suggestions out there.
thanks
How to Deal with Mud
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Shammy Davis
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I've got an area that gives me problems and I trench from that area to a fall line to allow the water to quickly run off. It never completely dries, but it is not a sloppy mess.
I've seen crushed stone and drainage pipes used in larger areas, but eventually the crushed stone sinks into the earth exposing the plastic drainage pipes that are easily damaged by hooves once exposed. Although crushed stone is fairly inexpensive in our area, the delivery charge is very high.
Trenching is a cheap and easy method. I use a tractor blade to make the trench. I have to re-trench about three or four times a year but only takes a few minutes once the initial trench is installed.
I've seen crushed stone and drainage pipes used in larger areas, but eventually the crushed stone sinks into the earth exposing the plastic drainage pipes that are easily damaged by hooves once exposed. Although crushed stone is fairly inexpensive in our area, the delivery charge is very high.
Trenching is a cheap and easy method. I use a tractor blade to make the trench. I have to re-trench about three or four times a year but only takes a few minutes once the initial trench is installed.
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kimberley mine
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I have some areas that are low that the horses hang around, so the pock marks from their hooves get deeper and deeper, holding more and more water, making the base softer and softer, etc.
One solution is to drop the bucket of the tractor and back drag it so that some water comes out (like a squeegee) and most of the pock marks are leveled. This has helped immensely on those wet winters when its months before any drying takes place.
jm
One solution is to drop the bucket of the tractor and back drag it so that some water comes out (like a squeegee) and most of the pock marks are leveled. This has helped immensely on those wet winters when its months before any drying takes place.
jm
Run the race - the one that's really worth winning.
Mud
Hi wgc,
Everytime I see the heading for this thread I am reminded of one of my rose beds. It never drained well. I finally tackled it a year + ago. I dug down and was going to replace the "soil" with better stuff. It was 10 inches of soil on top of asphalt. The flowerbed must have been an afterthought. Boy was I surprised.
Everytime I see the heading for this thread I am reminded of one of my rose beds. It never drained well. I finally tackled it a year + ago. I dug down and was going to replace the "soil" with better stuff. It was 10 inches of soil on top of asphalt. The flowerbed must have been an afterthought. Boy was I surprised.
Thanks for al the ideas. I had someone come and take the topsoil off and put down stone dust. It has been rain all day here but so far it is doing the job. I still get little puddles but there is no more mud and I think the horses really like it. I will repost once I get some time to see how it works out.
I think the stonedust was a good idea.
Everyone: We in Pennsylvania have had record rainfall this year. It is very bad. At our farm, our pasture is on top of a hill - and we still have horses knee-deep in mud. We had an antique (25 yo) gelding go down in the mud & he couldn't get back up. Picture a 50+ year old fat-woman wearing a knee-brace, leaping the 4-board fence to help him, landing in the muck, losing both Wellies & going on . . . while on the cell to neighbors to get help. (It wasn't pretty, but we got him out.)
Yeah, it isn't a good year here in PA. I am sick to death of rain & am ready to give away a couple of my favorite regional broodmares, just to get them OUT of the mud.
A french drain is a great idea in other conditions because the water has a place to go. Here, it doesn't. The water table around here is SO high, there is no place for it to drain.
Stonedust may be a temporary fix, but around here - that is as good as it gets this year.
Everyone: We in Pennsylvania have had record rainfall this year. It is very bad. At our farm, our pasture is on top of a hill - and we still have horses knee-deep in mud. We had an antique (25 yo) gelding go down in the mud & he couldn't get back up. Picture a 50+ year old fat-woman wearing a knee-brace, leaping the 4-board fence to help him, landing in the muck, losing both Wellies & going on . . . while on the cell to neighbors to get help. (It wasn't pretty, but we got him out.)
Yeah, it isn't a good year here in PA. I am sick to death of rain & am ready to give away a couple of my favorite regional broodmares, just to get them OUT of the mud.
A french drain is a great idea in other conditions because the water has a place to go. Here, it doesn't. The water table around here is SO high, there is no place for it to drain.
Stonedust may be a temporary fix, but around here - that is as good as it gets this year.
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Shammy Davis
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Without being too simplistic, sometimes you have to think like a crop farmer. Having raised hogs and horses on sloping land, there is no easy answer. My wife owned a landscaping business. She will tell you that techniques like french drains and crushed stones do not work in heavily traveled high usage areas and would not survive for very long under the stress of livestock and may cause higher compaction and erosion. They only work well in very low usage areas. Anyone who have a high usage gravel farm driveway will tell you that crushed stone and dust have limited life and is vulnerable to rain and erosion and though stone and dust are cheap they are quickly aborbed into the ground. No one that I know of has the perfect answer for poor drainage, but I thought these links might be helpful.
http://www.extension.umn.edu/distributi ... /07740.pdf
http://www.extension.umn.edu/distributi ... /07740.pdf
http://www.mawaterquality.org/capacity_ ... apter6.pdf
http://www.mda.state.md.us/pdf/seedsmlacr07.pdf
The Pacific northwest is wet year around. There are ideas in this link that might be helpful to some of you.
http://extension.oregonstate.edu/catalo ... ec1610.pdf
http://www.extension.umn.edu/distributi ... /07740.pdf
http://www.extension.umn.edu/distributi ... /07740.pdf
http://www.mawaterquality.org/capacity_ ... apter6.pdf
http://www.mda.state.md.us/pdf/seedsmlacr07.pdf
The Pacific northwest is wet year around. There are ideas in this link that might be helpful to some of you.
http://extension.oregonstate.edu/catalo ... ec1610.pdf
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Shammy Davis
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- Joined: Sat Oct 02, 2004 8:23 am
Diane wrote:
Your story reminded me of a retired naval officer who moved to the northern end of our county. He and his wife detested yard work, so he paved his entire 1/2 acre yard with asphalt. Predeceased by his wife, when he passed, his estate was unable to sell the place. The realtor recommended that they remove the asphalt, which they did. The only problem was that they couldn't get grass or anything else to grow on the property. Ten years later, the place is still vacant although weeds are beginning to multiply the once paved environment.
Hi wgc,
Everytime I see the heading for this thread I am reminded of one of my rose beds. It never drained well. I finally tackled it a year + ago. I dug down and was going to replace the "soil" with better stuff. It was 10 inches of soil on top of asphalt. The flowerbed must have been an afterthought. Boy was I surprised.
Your story reminded me of a retired naval officer who moved to the northern end of our county. He and his wife detested yard work, so he paved his entire 1/2 acre yard with asphalt. Predeceased by his wife, when he passed, his estate was unable to sell the place. The realtor recommended that they remove the asphalt, which they did. The only problem was that they couldn't get grass or anything else to grow on the property. Ten years later, the place is still vacant although weeds are beginning to multiply the once paved environment.
The one thing that does work here in the PNW is expensive - Hoofgrid.
We use it as part of a system starting with geotextile, drainage rock, Hoofgrid in high traffic areas, and then a 5/8 minus over the top. The upfront investment is high, but without the Hoofgrid, your gravel will get churned into the muck.
A 12x48 paddock with a "patio" of Hoofgrid for 12 feet outside the stall cost about $800 to do this way - if you don't include our labor and use of the farm tractor.
Although I considered it at the time (3 years ago) I wouldn't do the whole paddock in Hoofgrid - the loose gravel areas serve their purpose too , but still consider the extra 400ish dollars for the Hoofgrid a wise invement. My horse can eat his hay outside without a muddy mess and he always has a dry place to stand and enjoy the afternoon sunbreaks.
With this living arrangement, his feet don't abscess so frequently as before (I'd love to say "never" but he just had a tiny abscess after we pulled his back shoes) -- a happier, healthier horse is well worth the investment. Maintenance of the paddock is easier as well - keeping people happier and healthier too!
However, it should be mentioned is that all of this is possible because the barn was well situated in the first place -- the paddock slopes away from the barn, and that there is a French drain that runs along side it to carry the water that empties from the gutter at the end of the barn. No footing amendment can entirely solve a deeper drainage issue -- like asphalt under your rosebeds!
We use it as part of a system starting with geotextile, drainage rock, Hoofgrid in high traffic areas, and then a 5/8 minus over the top. The upfront investment is high, but without the Hoofgrid, your gravel will get churned into the muck.
A 12x48 paddock with a "patio" of Hoofgrid for 12 feet outside the stall cost about $800 to do this way - if you don't include our labor and use of the farm tractor.
Although I considered it at the time (3 years ago) I wouldn't do the whole paddock in Hoofgrid - the loose gravel areas serve their purpose too , but still consider the extra 400ish dollars for the Hoofgrid a wise invement. My horse can eat his hay outside without a muddy mess and he always has a dry place to stand and enjoy the afternoon sunbreaks.
With this living arrangement, his feet don't abscess so frequently as before (I'd love to say "never" but he just had a tiny abscess after we pulled his back shoes) -- a happier, healthier horse is well worth the investment. Maintenance of the paddock is easier as well - keeping people happier and healthier too!
However, it should be mentioned is that all of this is possible because the barn was well situated in the first place -- the paddock slopes away from the barn, and that there is a French drain that runs along side it to carry the water that empties from the gutter at the end of the barn. No footing amendment can entirely solve a deeper drainage issue -- like asphalt under your rosebeds!
I think I got the fix.
I put down 15 tons of stone dust and covered outside of 3 stall areas and a big walkway near the fence. I am very happy with it. We recently had 3 inches of rain here in a day and I had no muddy areas. The only area that collected water is where there hoof prints were but no big problems. Also, the stone dust seems to scrape the mud off there hoofs before they go into the stalls. It cost me $248.00 for dust and delivery. Very happy for now.
I put down 15 tons of stone dust and covered outside of 3 stall areas and a big walkway near the fence. I am very happy with it. We recently had 3 inches of rain here in a day and I had no muddy areas. The only area that collected water is where there hoof prints were but no big problems. Also, the stone dust seems to scrape the mud off there hoofs before they go into the stalls. It cost me $248.00 for dust and delivery. Very happy for now.