bad for business!!

doublete · Postby **doublete** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 9:27 pm

I dealt with some "breeders" back in may that had an unstarted 5 yo mare my father wanted to give the benefit if the doubt because he trusts people way too easily. Said horse was dropped off and two weeks into the little experiment I found out why. Contacted them as they had not left papers... they said they would come get her... time went by and they didn't come and then wouldnt answer calls.. this is December and I still don't have her papers...I'm still caring for her... so much for caring about their homebred and where she ended up... same issues from race training have come into play as a riding horse so she really isn't much use.
that's a moot point at this point.

Fast forward.. I find out they stood a stallion as a state bred offering in 2012 and he got over a dozen mares in foal. The agent that brokered the original deal for this nicely bred however totally unproven stallion contacted me because the deadline was today for them to pay the state bred money.. mind you they have had all year.. well problem is they don't have the horses papers.. I contacted the trainer that is holding them from a rather large unpaid training bill (not theirs but they knew) and he would release for a sum I was willing to pay along with state fee... they declined (actually didn't return my calls) and wouldn't negotiate. So now the mare owners will find out their babies are not state bred eligible and they had a way to salvage this....my offer was reasonable. For an unproven stallion that now they plan to geld and sell tor riding (although they claim he has soundness issues which preclude him from racing- so I'm not sure how they'll sell a sore gelding.)...what they wanted was to be paid quite handsomely for the time they put into him which to me was more than saving their Rep should warrant....

Anyways... these two dealings soured me and I hope people check into breeders reps... also when we took the first mare we did call prior trainers and they all said "bad pay"...

I'm not one to speak badly of people without warrant but these two situations are pretty bad for all involved.. the untattooed unstarted unpapered mare that was abandoned for all intents and purposes and now the owners of the mares that are going to find out they were lied to. I know word of mouth is very important in the racing and horse business butim going to safely say I'm not the only one dealing with these people unhappily.

ageecee · Postby **ageecee** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 10:26 pm

do they still run horses? If so you can go to stewards and perhaps collect some of the money.

doublete · Postby **doublete** » Mon Dec 31, 2012 10:38 pm

I'm not even concerned about the abandoned mare(although papers would've been nice)... just really hope the mares owners that bred to the stallion realize what happened (and that they had a way out they chose not to take in favor of a really unrealistic path)

Supernova · Postby **Supernova** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 6:27 am

People suck, and they leave good folks like you to clean up their mess.

ageecee · Postby **ageecee** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:13 am

I would do everything i could to embarrass these people in any way shape or form. I would out an ad in the local newspaper if i had to.

doublete · Postby **doublete** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:02 am

Well. They have Facebook and have posted here. They still haven't gotten back to me so it does appear they will geld this young horse and try to sell as a riding horse... I hope some of the babies make it to the races and do very well in spite of this all

ageecee · Postby **ageecee** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:28 am

whats there facebook page i want to check it out...

IcouldbeU · Postby **IcouldbeU** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:52 am

I am confused. Did you breed to their stallion? If not, isn't this a case of MYOB and let the breeders find out when the time comes.

I don't understand what you would have gained by helping them out by getting the "stallion's" papers so that he could be registered with whatever state is requiring them, I am guessing WV?

Unless you are trying to "out" them here since you state that they post here from time to time, I just don't see the point of your post except to vent. I could do that all day long with a farm from LA that used to post here.

Good luck with whatever you plan to do with the grade filly that they so nicely left you. If you know where their farm is, why not just drop her back off there?

doublete · Postby **doublete** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:00 am

It is a vent, and yes it is to out them. It is bad for business!!!!!

I did not breed to their stallion, but I did offer a very reasonable way to salvage their reputation and their stallion. I was asked to try to help by the agent that set it up. So I did try. They were totally unreasonable and I truly feel bad for the breeders. I was going to take the stallion myself. He was a very expensive yearling purchase and the trainer that is holding the papers said he didn't have soudness issues. The current breeders say he is sore (but that begs the question, if he is too sore to go into race training again, how is he sound enough to sell as a riding horse).
I offered to pay the bills necessary to get him state bred so their breeders would have no reason to be upset with them, and I was going to take the stallion to try him in training. if that didn't work I would have considered letting them stand him. (not now obviously but that was part of the original deal). And they were going to retain breeders awards from the mares they bred.

I am sorry, but that to me makes more sense than gelding a horse that could potentially produce some decent runners and not even attempting to get his papers. Common sense to me.

But yes, this is a vent. I'm very upset that they dumped the original 5 year old (now 6) with soundness problems on me, without her papers (although they said they would send them or pick her up). And I didn't pick her up, they dropped her off...

doublete · Postby **doublete** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:02 am

Oh, and the filly, I've had her for 8 months now. I leased her to a riding school, but the "bandage bows" that bothered her two weeks into galloping have already flared up twice so I am not sure what I will do if she can't hold up to w/t/c lessons. I do now know what the hurry was to drop her off to me though. :roll:

IcouldbeU · Postby **IcouldbeU** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:04 am

Thanks for the clarification. It makes alittle more sense now. Again, good luck

doublete · Postby **doublete** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:08 am

Thanks.. Sorry for the confusion... VERY expensive yearling purchase I thought deserved a chance... (although I owned one just slightly less than him at $240k keeneland yearling purchase who broke his maiden for 4k at penn... poor fella didn't live up to the hype).

ageecee · Postby **ageecee** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:13 am

and these people are bad pay or slow pay?

Jeff · Postby **Jeff** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 1:11 pm

Embarrass these people into doing the right thing? That's the best laugh I've had all year!

doublete · Postby **doublete** » Tue Jan 01, 2013 1:36 pm

I was told bad pay but I had agreed to take the mare for myself... When she didnt work out after two weeks I gave them two options pick up mare or send papers. So no money was to exchange hands.

All they had to do was use stud fees to pay the old training bill and get the stallions papers. They waited til dec 31 and when offered a way out of embarassment they chose not to. Typical.

How do they tell the mare owners? That's embarrassing in itself. I was told by the trainer holding the papers on the stallion that he has already notified the Jc of the situation so there is no hope of duplicate papers