What are graun byproducts?
Iknow that when I see meat byproduts listed in dog food it means ground up parts of the chickin or other animal that can not be sold any other way. So what are the processed grain byproducts I see listed in horse feed?
Two examples:
Bartlett Horse 13.5% Maintence Pellets
"processed grain byproducts, grain products, roughage products, plant protein products, calcium carbinates and so on.'
Tizwhiz 165 Horse Feed
"ground corn, soybean meal, ground oats, wheat millings, cane molasses, dicalcium phosphate, calcium carbinate, salt yeast culture and so on"
By the way, what are wheat millings?
thanks
griff
Grain byproducts
Moderators: Roguelet, hpkingjr, WaveMaster
Grain byproducts
"We has met the enemy and he is us" [Pogo]
Some mfg. do not like to list specific products because then they are commited to putting exactly that in the feed as listed. When they say grain products it gives them the freedom to subsitute different grains depending on what is cheaper or easier to get at a different time. There may be less consistency in the product.
Grain byproducts are all the junk leftover from processing grain for products they can sell. If there was food value in wheat hulls and soybean hulls we would eat them.
One of the biggest beefs I have with these so called supercharged feeds in the glossy bags with the picture of Secretariat on the front is that they contain so much garbage. I feed whole oats. My broodmare mix is made by a local mill and is about half oats, ground soybean meal, alfalfa pellets, etc. It has added Calcium, Copper and Selenium and is a fully balanced ration... and my mares all have nice big bellies to show for it.
Something key to understand about the products you buy is that if distribution and transportation are required for the product, they will triple the price of something that weighs a lot... So you keep the sales and marketing dudes and the truckers in business when you buy a feed made, say, in Ohio and buy it in, say, Texas.... I would rather go to a local mill with no logo and have the money I spend be entirely IN THE BAG... The local mill's "distribution" charge is the $20 delivery fee to bring a truckload 35 miles each way to my farm. The bags are the cheap white woven poly kind with no printing, but there is a content tag on each bag.. How much do you think you pay for that glossy bag? And the transportation of the feed? Hay is outrageous in Florida... not because it is better but because it is TRUCKED IN...
One of the biggest beefs I have with these so called supercharged feeds in the glossy bags with the picture of Secretariat on the front is that they contain so much garbage. I feed whole oats. My broodmare mix is made by a local mill and is about half oats, ground soybean meal, alfalfa pellets, etc. It has added Calcium, Copper and Selenium and is a fully balanced ration... and my mares all have nice big bellies to show for it.
Something key to understand about the products you buy is that if distribution and transportation are required for the product, they will triple the price of something that weighs a lot... So you keep the sales and marketing dudes and the truckers in business when you buy a feed made, say, in Ohio and buy it in, say, Texas.... I would rather go to a local mill with no logo and have the money I spend be entirely IN THE BAG... The local mill's "distribution" charge is the $20 delivery fee to bring a truckload 35 miles each way to my farm. The bags are the cheap white woven poly kind with no printing, but there is a content tag on each bag.. How much do you think you pay for that glossy bag? And the transportation of the feed? Hay is outrageous in Florida... not because it is better but because it is TRUCKED IN...
So Run for the Roses, as fast as you can.....
As an animal nutritionist (Iowa State and University of Kentucky) I felt I had to enter this discussion.
Grain byproduct can have significant nutritional value. Many are the result of processing that has removed the carbohydrate portion for flour, fructose, fermentation etc. The remain portions may be higher in protein and fat content and (in some cases)are more valuable on a per pound basis than was the original grain.
Some grain products, such as wheat mids, help in getting better quality pellets, reducing dustiness of the feed.
Soy hulls are a fiber source that humans can not digest, but is digestible in the large intestine of the horse producing volatile fatty acids, a major energy source and nutrient for horses (the natural byproduct of fermentation that they have evolved to utilize)
Don't read to much negative into the inclusion of grain by-products.
Having said that, yes a poor quality feed can be made using dust screenings etc. You need to evaluate the manufacturer as well as the label on the bag. Given some time, the best evaluation is the condition of your animals, i.e. muscle tone, coat conditon, normal cycles for mare, etc. [I don't think I would use "big bellies" as a criteria]
I do agree that horse feed is "on a whole" overpriced. I agree with Madelyn that far to much is spent on packaging, marketing and freight. Unfortunately the equine market is in general more of a "consumer" good, i.e. marketed more like a dog food than cattle feed. Even among feed companies that do not use fancy packaging you will often find an increase in price for equine products over the same product or very similar products marketed to production animal.
Custom blending can be a good alternative, however to be cost effective most places will need a 2 ton minimum (common blender size) and you need to formulate the feed correctly to match your forages. You need to consider trace minerals and fat soluble vitamin levels in addition to the macro nutrients such as protein, energy, Ca, P, Mg etc. Make sure that the formulation has been reviewed by someone with the knowledge to properly evalute the mix. Poor feed is to expensive to feed, regardless how cheap it may have been per ton.
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Grain byproduct can have significant nutritional value. Many are the result of processing that has removed the carbohydrate portion for flour, fructose, fermentation etc. The remain portions may be higher in protein and fat content and (in some cases)are more valuable on a per pound basis than was the original grain.
Some grain products, such as wheat mids, help in getting better quality pellets, reducing dustiness of the feed.
Soy hulls are a fiber source that humans can not digest, but is digestible in the large intestine of the horse producing volatile fatty acids, a major energy source and nutrient for horses (the natural byproduct of fermentation that they have evolved to utilize)
Don't read to much negative into the inclusion of grain by-products.
Having said that, yes a poor quality feed can be made using dust screenings etc. You need to evaluate the manufacturer as well as the label on the bag. Given some time, the best evaluation is the condition of your animals, i.e. muscle tone, coat conditon, normal cycles for mare, etc. [I don't think I would use "big bellies" as a criteria]
I do agree that horse feed is "on a whole" overpriced. I agree with Madelyn that far to much is spent on packaging, marketing and freight. Unfortunately the equine market is in general more of a "consumer" good, i.e. marketed more like a dog food than cattle feed. Even among feed companies that do not use fancy packaging you will often find an increase in price for equine products over the same product or very similar products marketed to production animal.
Custom blending can be a good alternative, however to be cost effective most places will need a 2 ton minimum (common blender size) and you need to formulate the feed correctly to match your forages. You need to consider trace minerals and fat soluble vitamin levels in addition to the macro nutrients such as protein, energy, Ca, P, Mg etc. Make sure that the formulation has been reviewed by someone with the knowledge to properly evalute the mix. Poor feed is to expensive to feed, regardless how cheap it may have been per ton.
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Big Bellies
Now I know what has caused my problem, I must have unknowingly been loading up on those grain by products at the salad bar. They don't make beer out of those by products do they?
That's what I thought. When I buy a horse feed that lists grain byproducts as the first ingrediant I'm buying hulls and soybean meal for $15 to $20 per hundred while the December spot price for whole oats is $1.67 per bushel or about $4.20 per hundred in bulk
Even if I pay $6 per hundred for oats I'm getting real feed for one-third to one-forth the cost of the roughage and soybean meal that's being sold as horse feed.
Another thing I like about oats is I can feed them free choice. Once a horse gets full they rarely eat more than 10 pounds per day and at 4.2 to 6 cents per pound that's reasonable.
griff
Even if I pay $6 per hundred for oats I'm getting real feed for one-third to one-forth the cost of the roughage and soybean meal that's being sold as horse feed.
Another thing I like about oats is I can feed them free choice. Once a horse gets full they rarely eat more than 10 pounds per day and at 4.2 to 6 cents per pound that's reasonable.
griff
"We has met the enemy and he is us" [Pogo]
Yes, Bryan, thanks for the clarification. Perhaps it would be more informative if the producers listed exactly WHICH grain byproducts are in the feed. I use free choice minerals to supplement oats for the rank and file and also my broodmares have access to minerals as well as their broodmare food. One of the clues I discovered in the last year to determine if the quantity and quality, as well as selection, of foods were sufficient is coat and COLOR. The colors are deep, coats are gleaming, bays are dappled, etc. I also worm monthly, and vaccinate annually (except Rhino, every 6 mos, every 2 mos for pregnant mares). Also, hooves are good..
Perhaps you could also address the addition of animal fat to horsefeed.. I have seen it on several tags. I choose to not buy horsefeed with animal fat.. I believe horses, being herbivores, were not meant to consume products from other animals.
Perhaps you could also address the addition of animal fat to horsefeed.. I have seen it on several tags. I choose to not buy horsefeed with animal fat.. I believe horses, being herbivores, were not meant to consume products from other animals.
So Run for the Roses, as fast as you can.....
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louis finochio
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I learned long ago when you breathe your breath on grain products or pellets and can smell the fresh natural aroma of grain the feed is ok.
When you smell a dusty and musty smell the grain product is old and has fillers in the mix. This is the feed you want to avoid.
Look at the feed with your eyes and learn how to tell quality feed from inferior feed. Another way is to sift the feed with a screen and see if their is lots of dust or dirt that is being screened out. When you screen your feed watch for weavels or mites, as the feed should be returned to your feed company.
When you smell a dusty and musty smell the grain product is old and has fillers in the mix. This is the feed you want to avoid.
Look at the feed with your eyes and learn how to tell quality feed from inferior feed. Another way is to sift the feed with a screen and see if their is lots of dust or dirt that is being screened out. When you screen your feed watch for weavels or mites, as the feed should be returned to your feed company.
Those without sin cast the first stone.
Louis Finochio
Louis Finochio
griff wrote:That's what I thought. When I buy a horse feed that lists grain byproducts as the first ingrediant I'm buying hulls and soybean meal for $15 to $20 per hundred while the December spot price for whole oats is $1.67 per bushel or about $4.20 per hundred in bulk
Even if I pay $6 per hundred for oats I'm getting real feed for one-third to one-forth the cost of the roughage and soybean meal that's being sold as horse feed.
Another thing I like about oats is I can feed them free choice. Once a horse gets full they rarely eat more than 10 pounds per day and at 4.2 to 6 cents per pound that's reasonable.
griff
I totally agree.. I buy soybean meal for $10/100 lb and can add it in for a skinny horse, along with beet pulp and cracked corn. Regarding the oats, yup, they will walk away when they are full.
So Run for the Roses, as fast as you can.....