Horse partnerships with trainers

[bdw0617]

I have been noticing a trend recently... maybe it's been around but i'm young. that trend is a trainer going in on a young horse with a group of people and ovbiusly leaving that horse to train with the trainer

IMHO there are a lot of beneifts for the trainer and not enough beneifts for the owner. .at least the other ones.

the trainer gets his hands more times than not on a nice horse and gives him the horse that can get him to that center stage. See Currin with stormello.


But for the other owners I just don't see the upside. I won't use stormello because that is the most ovbious of choices, but let's use another horse who I thought had a ton of talent that got used and abused to get to the derby.. Hurry up austin.


hurry up austin started out as a claimer.. showed that he was better than a claimer and instead of putting him in an allowence race, was put in every stake race they could find while he was still 2years old. Just how successful where they? well he's 4 with about 12 races and he's stil elgiable for NW1X other than races. a horse with this type of talent that's unaccecptable. He's not a derby horse. .he's not a high level stgakes horse. but god damnit he's a good horse. and to have a horse like this come in last after last, bad performance after bad performance.. it's shameful

In a hurry to get graded stakes earnings back in late janurary I remember watching him going in a 5 horse stakes race, grade 3 sprint I think and his shoe fell off and he was scratched and the trainer was peeved because "it's a 5 horse race and it's graded stakes earnings"... he follows it up by entering him in an allowence race tha the can't even win!

He raced today.. 4th place against a bunch of horses that if he was trained right he would clean their clock.

as a horse owner I should always be able or have the option to switch trainers becaause I dont' think that at all times, the trianers best interest and the other owners best interest are one in the same.

[winds]

I guess what it comes down to is the owners need to do due diligents in their homework regarding what they are getting into especially when it comes to the trainer.

I worked for Tony Dutrow. Tony goes to the sales and buys horses for his owners and his money is in there too, but what he does and his owners know that he does is try to develop the horses early to get them to win first or second time out and sell at a profit. They do know how ever, that he is a horseman, and will not do anything to hurt a horse towards those means. He is a true horseman and his owners know that.

So, if someone wants to get into a syndicate they need to do some homework regarding all aspects.

winds

[AscotStud]

I think it's that way when any trainer gets a good one on their hands regardless of if they own a part or not. Look how Pletcher ran Impeachment (who my brother now owns), 5 grade 1's in a row 11 races in 8 months (since his career debut) including all 3 races the triple crown. He was out to prove a point that year running 4 in the Derby and in any other big race he could get a horse into. In the end the horse injured his suspensory in the Travers, the syndicate took the money and retired him instead of giving him the time off he needed and 8 years later he's in Canada. A little time off and maybe and a start in a grade 2 or 3 might have given him a better chance at a better, longer career. These days Pletcher gives them 5 weeks between starts.

I don't think Currin belongs in that lot though, he breeds pretty much everything he trains and has 1 long time partner aside from his wife. He has also had more than just Stormello and had been to the big dance before. He like flying all over the place to run them, but his wife is pretty much the only one he has to answer to.

[Jane]

I like having horses in partnership with my trainer, what I don't like is having partners that don't have at least 10 years experience owning horses.

The way I see it, if the horse is good enough for my trainer to spend his money on then I'm good with it too. No decent trainer is making money on his dayrate and I don't mind spreading out the risk and only owning 1/2 a horse and paying 1/2 the bills while only having 1/2 as much worry.

This game is hard enough, you need to find a trainer you can trust. It's often not the guy with the biggest win percentage or biggest outfit that is the best one to take care of your horse.

[westover]

Jane i couldn't have said that better myself. A lot of the big barns are factories and the horses are quite disposable due to sheer #'s. I would never want a partner who was not a seasoned horse person either. Although i have to say my bosses are not horse people at all & they are very understanding of the bills & i would have to say never complain. We skimp on nothing & cut no corners. That said it is a hobby not their living. I know what a nightmare it can be to be a trainer and have owners who just don't get it. I would absolutely do a partnership with a trainer i knew and trusted. a. it offsets costs
b. if the trainer has a piece of the horse you can be sure they are going to give it their best shot. I can think of 2 trainers off hand i would not hesitate to enter that type of a venture with, and i am the queen of caution on business dealings. Great way to put it Jane. Although i have to say my husband & i both work in the industry & we own 0 horses.

[NorthStar]

the trainer gets his hands more times than not on a nice horse and gives him the horse that can get him to that center stage. See Currin with stormello.

I'm not sure I get your point when you throw Currin/Stormello into the mix. First, Currin and his wife breeds and he trains most of his horses. He had Memorette before Stormello. Do I think he could take some advice from some real horseman, yes. But if he is going partners with some other people, you can bet they wanted in on the action, not the other way around. JMHO.

[jainct]

I have been noticing a trend recently... maybe it's been around but i'm young. that trend is a trainer going in on a young horse with a group of people and ovbiusly leaving that horse to train with the trainer

IMHO there are a lot of beneifts for the trainer and not enough beneifts for the owner. .at least the other ones.

the trainer gets his hands more times than not on a nice horse and gives him the horse that can get him to that center stage. See Currin with stormello.


But for the other owners I just don't see the upside. I won't use stormello because that is the most ovbious of choices, but let's use another horse who I thought had a ton of talent that got used and abused to get to the derby.. Hurry up austin.


hurry up austin started out as a claimer.. showed that he was better than a claimer and instead of putting him in an allowence race, was put in every stake race they could find while he was still 2years old. Just how successful where they? well he's 4 with about 12 races and he's stil elgiable for NW1X other than races. a horse with this type of talent that's unaccecptable. He's not a derby horse. .he's not a high level stgakes horse. but god damnit he's a good horse. and to have a horse like this come in last after last, bad performance after bad performance.. it's shameful

In a hurry to get graded stakes earnings back in late janurary I remember watching him going in a 5 horse stakes race, grade 3 sprint I think and his shoe fell off and he was scratched and the trainer was peeved because "it's a 5 horse race and it's graded stakes earnings"... he follows it up by entering him in an allowence race tha the can't even win!

He raced today.. 4th place against a bunch of horses that if he was trained right he would clean their clock.

as a horse owner I should always be able or have the option to switch trainers becaause I dont' think that at all times, the trianers best interest and the other owners best interest are one in the same.

If you take a look at those 2yo stake races he was in, you will find that many of the horses he was facing were winners of 1 race (msw). As a matter of fact, the trainer found stakes where he could compete in. It was a good opportunity to get BLACK TYPE. He really was not beat badly in those 2yo races and did manage to pick up checks along the way. When you get a chance you should take a look at those 2yo stakes and see the careers of those horses Austin faced and you might feel differently and understand why he was in those races.

jainct

[madelyn]

Jane, the partnerships I have had with trainers were based on me putting up the horse and the trainer putting up the training. There was no "splitting" of costs, just earnings. Other deals were where there was a partial split of costs, but the percentage of winnings for the horse owner was much higher than 50%.