Pipe dream or not?

[spex4me]

Does anyone think it would be possible for the tracks to card races that had the condition of no medication, with perhaps a cut off date of 45 - 90 days, or a cut off period of something else?

A lot of people I talk to will say "Bobo gets lasix because we can and it's hard to race other horses who are on it when we are not" and "if all horses in the race entered in the same physiological condition, we'd be all over that".

Has perhaps some races turned into monkey see monkey do? Not looking for arguement but rather why or why not ?

[MaryAinMI]

It will only work if ALL the tracks do it at the same time. If only a few tracks do it, trainers will move to tracks that race without that requirement, and the "no drugs" tracks will be left with unfilled racing cards.

[madelyn]

Dang.. we could call it the "Just Say No" series ! Like the Gray horse races! Make it a novelty!

Seriously, my trainer happened to comment that since Indiana banned steroids it has really levelled the field. He named trainers who had high stats last year who were now down among the ordinary guys since they couldn't pump their horses up anymore.

[Denise]

Madelyn,
Since PA has also implemented the 'roids ban, not only are some trainer stats showing a reversal, but I was told it has dramatically improved horse behavior in the paddocks and post parades at one of our racetracks in particular.
Regarding the thread here, the trend may very well be toward "clean" jurisdictions, and "anything goes" jurisdictions, and races as well. I've always thought that if trainers were unwilling to stop using steroids and other raceday medications, why not just publish the information in the form, i.e., "S" right next to "B" and "L", for example?
Frankly, there might not be enough room next to the horse's name for some trainers' lists of goodies.

[ageecee]

Pipe Dream..

[spex4me]

lmao the "Just say No" series..... just think of all the little rugrats we could incorporate into being future fans of racing..... wait, I'd even have to check if the whole "Drug Abuse Resistance through Education" even exists anymore.... perhaps a societal tide wiped them out too....

I think maybe it's a pipe dream too, though honestly I wish it weren't.... I just got back from training today and it was literally a close to a 70/30 split when asked. (70 including pro and ppl who thought they would at least try it) That's why I thought , hell if you can give ppl a choice than everyone can be happy..... maybe I think too much, most likely too little!

[KamiBrooks]

All they'd have to do is put routine drug/lasix free races in the condition book (ideally w/o tag). If there are trainers that want to race that way, the races will fill. I don't think its a pipe dream to put the possibility out there to see if there is any intrest.

If you think about it, a smart track would write them in condition books so that when the public complains they can say "we give them the opportunity, but the trainers don't take it"... that way the track can put the "blame" on the trainers.

[Sock Monkey]

Spex, I'm with ageecee on this one. Sorry. What would be the point? If you want to run your horse drug free, nothing is stopping you from it. Most trainers are going to tell you Lasix is cheap and you may as well use it just in case it helps. Why risk having a bad race and why risk making a horse bleed if you can do something to prevent it? But, you do see horses run sans Lasix and do well against medicated horses. So, for those who want to run "clean" do it - nothing is stopping you.

Same thing with steroids.

[Crystal]

D.A.R.E to keep horses off of drugs.. SOMEONE START MAKING BUMPER STICKERS!!! yeah its a pipedream.

[madelyn]

What stops trainers from running drug free is that it is REALLY hard to compete with a 'roided monster on Lasix. If not impossible.

[Bid]

If there is money to be had, it will work. Card some clean races and announce them before the meet starts. The purse money needs to be good. Trainers who want to pick up purse money in what will be short fields initially will plan to keep horses clean. As more trainers clean up and those fields get bigger, put bonus money in the "clean" race purses. Eventually you can eliminate the dirty races.
Sock, I respectfully disagree with the "you can run your horse clean if you want" idea. You may win here and there, but you cannot compete with the animals on steroids and other drugs over the long haul. It's tough enough to survive as a small owner. Racing against horses we will never afford that are also juiced is tough to swallow.
We need to clean up our own act. If some of these yahoos that know nothing about racing can convince Congress to get involved we're in real trouble. We will face the imposition of rules by people not familiar with racing who can't seem to spend less tax money than they take in. Man, I feel real comfortable with that

[MaryAinMI]

If there is money to be had, it will work.

Well ... it might work. Worth a try. The thing is, as you say, the trainers that run clean have to be rewarded by better purses.

Somehow, the track has to be rewarded, too, for taking the chance on unfilled cards currently and in the future. Trainers that don't want to bother toeing the drug free line will take their business elsewhere at the beginning, and they'll find plenty of places that want their business.

Jockey Club and NTRA are jumping on the situation. NTRA pointed out how urgent it is to institute reform in the industry (hopefully that includes the massive illegal drugging of horses at the low end tracks in the low end claiming raices). They know they have to produce results to keep the Congress out of it.

Getting Congree in there would be a real setback, I think - too many special interests of their own to keep happy. Plus Congress cannot get anything this complicated done very quickly at all.

[spex4me]

I had a good talk with another one my vets yesterday about this. He actually suprised me when he said Lasix didn't really bother him for it's intended use, but apparently he is of the belief that most seem to use it for the diuretic effect. I thought he meant weight drop, he corrected me with precluding to flushing of the system. I was of the impression that couldn't be done anymore for I thought testing was as stringent as it could be, but apparently he didn' share my view. While he is an excellent equine practitioner , he doesn't do the track scene so I am hoping he may be wrong. Hoping.......

The steroid bit......well that was a lecture and a half. Basically for all the reasons I have read here against them, and then some, he railed against the practice. I don't think I even heard him say they have their place, but I could have missed that in the sermon. Not complaining. I am not a vet, so I value his input.

He also stated that growing up in MD... I think he said around Bowie, people with race horses used to have weekend meets, much like a horse show set up, with tiny purses if any. It sounded like great fun, but alas perhaps too innocent for today's times.

So after this talk, I decided that if my horse can't out run a probable tiny push of lasix in another horse, then perhaps she's not the athlete I am ultimately looking for. Don't get me wrong she'll be with us hell or high water, she'll just have another barn "job". But I still would like the opportunity to not have to compete with steroids. Thank goodness the states I am interested in running (PA,VA, & DE) have pretty strict bans in effect. So I guess I get half of that pipe dream.

[KamiBrooks]

Getting Congree in there would be a real setback, I think - too many special interests of their own to keep happy. Plus Congress cannot get anything this complicated done very quickly at all.

Actually that would kill it in a heart beat. Remember that it is pharmaceutical companies who are making money off of the use of drugs at the track. I doubt congress would ban (or even put realistic controls on) anything sold by a pharmaceutical company.

Somehow, the track has to be rewarded, too, for taking the chance on unfilled cards currently and in the future. Trainers that don't want to bother toeing the drug free line will take their business elsewhere at the beginning, and they'll find plenty of places that want their business.

I don't think drug-free races would be any different than state restricted races. Trainers with interest in drug-free might actually relo to those tracks just for the chance of an even field. With a good enough purse structure, it might even encourage trainers to give it a try. Lots of tracks runs a marathon series all summer that works its way up to 2 miles. Those races manage to fill and I don't think anyone gets upset at them. They could call drug-free races "raw", "naked" or something provocative and run a "raw series" or call them "naked spints" and "naked routes"