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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2011 9:16 am 
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Quote:

"good luck getting Gainesway to approve that mare for his book!"


Quote:

"simply do it because it would be fun... not to try and get the investment back."

Both quotes are absolutely correct, yet every now and then someone tries to abbreviate the route to obtain any given trait via an expensive
lineage. That's the reason why when someone factually predicts a good sire and take advantage of it, its a big BINGO! :wink:

Consolation prize: At least we all must appreciate the good work Dalene Knight (just to mention one example) has achieved with the excellent bloodlines of her sires. :D


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 6:40 am 
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Well, who knows if the scintillanting speedster CONCORD POINT may well be a quite meritorious unproven alternative at a lower price. It's a gamble given its a new stallion but if it turns right...BINGO!

CONCORD POINT http://www.pedigreequery.com/concord+point


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:39 am 
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Jorge wrote:
Wow, would really like to see a product by Tapit out of ________ by
Airdrie Apache, or by Puchulingui, or those lineages.


I know this is probably a stupid question, but stud fee aside, what would be the benefit of crossing these lines? If you're looking for racing ability, the Airdrie Apache and Puchulingui lines haven't produced much. If you're looking for color, Tapit's gray would mean a high probability of offspring that might look spectacular for a while, but would fade into white in their maturity. If you're looking for both qualities, well, they seem to cancel each other out, for the reasons I just mentioned.

What am I missing here?


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 1:25 pm 
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pfrsue wrote:
Jorge wrote:
Wow, would really like to see a product by Tapit out of ________ by
Airdrie Apache, or by Puchulingui, or those lineages.


what would be the benefit of crossing these lines? If you're looking for racing ability, the Airdrie Apache and Puchulingui lines haven't produced much. If you're looking for color, Tapit's gray would mean a high probability of offspring that might look spectacular for a while, but would fade into white in their maturity. If you're looking for both qualities, well, they seem to cancel each other out, for the reasons I just mentioned.

What am I missing here?


ANSWER: No one knows for sure because we are dealing with genetic odds. But who knows if since Tapit is siring so many talented runners we may end up with a decent horse along with a flamboyant color. But predictions are not easy. Take for example, the bay, Mucho Macho Man, who came from a pair of gray parents, became a stakes winner, but failed at the easiest of probabilities ---being a gray.


Perhaps something like the horse named "MUCHO MACHO MAN", who was the result si


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 1:27 pm 
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Jorge wrote:
pfrsue wrote:
Jorge wrote:
Wow, would really like to see a product by Tapit out of ________ by
Airdrie Apache, or by Puchulingui, or those lineages.


what would be the benefit of crossing these lines? If you're looking for racing ability, the Airdrie Apache and Puchulingui lines haven't produced much. If you're looking for color, Tapit's gray would mean a high probability of offspring that might look spectacular for a while, but would fade into white in their maturity. If you're looking for both qualities, well, they seem to cancel each other out, for the reasons I just mentioned.

What am I missing here?


ANSWER: No one knows for sure because we are dealing with genetic odds. But who knows if since Tapit is siring so many talented runners we may end up with a decent horse along with a flamboyant color. But predictions are not easy. Take for example, the bay, Mucho Macho Man, who came from a pair of gray parents, became a stakes winner, but failed at the easiest of probabilities ---being a gray.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:31 am 
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After watching what happened during the last two weekends I reaffirm the title of this topic. It's awesome!


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 3:31 pm 
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I'd love to see a bay or chestnut Tapit filly bred to Guaranteed Gold. That'll be a diluted foal with a good chance of being a racer.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:24 pm 
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The dilute gene possessed by Guaranteed Gold is not grey. The genes for grey and palomino are on totally different chromosones. If you get grey and palomino on the same offspring it would simply turn grey. The cream gene is recessive, the grey gene is a dominant. If it is going to be grey anyway, why bother breeding for color if the color won't be seen?


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:31 pm 
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The chestnut could produce palomino, yes. If the bay carries a chestnut gene there is a chance for palomino. Neither could produce grey unless they were actually grey. They would be grey if they had the grey gene.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:41 pm 
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Actually cream is a Incomplete Dominant. Over chestnut 1 copy = Palomino, 2 copies =Cremello. So the cream gene usually shows up if only one copy is present. And usually means without other dark modifiers that may mask the dilute. There are some very very dark palominos and buckskins out there.

Breeding to Tapit or any other gray just increases the chance that you will get a dark dilute that goes gray and fades to white.

The folks that have the Patchen line of Dominant whites have been breeding to racing stallions, with some success.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:56 pm 
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That's why i said to breed a bay or chestnut Tapit mare to GG. If it is a gray mare, more likely the foal would be gray, even if still diluted. I just feel that a mare like that would give the foal a good chance of being a racer.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 8:37 pm 
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I reiterate the topic of this thread. By the way, TAPIT is still competitive enough to earn top-sire honors. Even the non-gray Tapizar made him earn a few more "peanuts". What a great sire TAPIT has become!


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 9:26 pm 
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Yes, Hansen really made me pay attention to Tapit today.

Also intriguing to see how white he is at only 2.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 2:29 pm 
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After seeing Hansen's winning run yesterday, was struck by his very light gray coat. He's by Tapit a gray, out of a bay mare. He's a 2009 foal. Hasen't he turned gray very fast? Do the Tapits usually lighten up this fast?
One to watch.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 3:51 pm 
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It IS extraordinarily fast, but not for a Tapit. His tend to lighten VERY quickly, as opposed to the Holy Bull line which tends to take it's time.

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