breeding suggestions
Moderators: Roguelet, WaveMaster, madelyn, Diane
breeding suggestions
I have a Mare named New Account, listed here at DMTC. I am wanting to breed her with the hope of racing the off spring in the north west. some help would be great. Not wanting to spend an arm and leg for stud fee, as The northwest purses aren't that great.
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tough hombre
- Weanling
- Posts: 43
- Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 8:46 pm
- Location: Mt.Vernon Ar.
- Contact:
I've been nicking for my mare Peaceful Terms for the last couple of years so I have nicked a lot of sires with the same cross you have. I ran a nick on your mare New account (1990 model) with Wild Zone and came up the same as mine A+ (+1367%) I don't claim to know a lot about Werk Ratings but I have seen a lot worse and not many any better. Since I love Sultry Song and this cross it is an A (+327) and she will also be an A nick with Little Expectations, All of these sires are reasonable W.Z.$5000,S.S. $5000 and L.E. $3500. I have always liked Sultry Song and now because of Singletary a lot of people will jump on the band wagon. Good luck.
Tom Mix
Tom Mix
I would consider Mr. Prospector lines.
Baquero who is by Forty Niner seems to have sired some useful horses and he is in Oregon standing for $1500. Aldebaran a champion sprinter is by Mr. P and out of a private Account mare. Of course Miner's Mark who won the Jockey Club Gold Cup is out of Personal Ensign and by Mr. Prospector. The farm also has some sons of Mr. Prospector. Cahill Road who is in Washington is an option but would cost more money and he is a full brother to Unbridled and also a grandson of Mr. Prospector. You can't go wrong with Mr. Prospector lines. If you want to line breed on Hail to Reason my cousin has a stud named Starmaniac who is graded stakes placed and out of a full sister to Hawkster. He is a grandson of Seattle Slew and is standing in Idaho.
Keith
Keith
Hey Knac,
Where abouts in the Pac North are you?I had a quick look at your mare and her chief money earner according to the DMPQ seemed to be by Dixieland Band.You could look at Dixieland Brass standing in BC at Flying Horse Farms or if you wanted to look a little bit at the sire's in the Pac North go to www.cthsbc.org and looked at the sires list in the drop down menus.
Ryeno
Where abouts in the Pac North are you?I had a quick look at your mare and her chief money earner according to the DMPQ seemed to be by Dixieland Band.You could look at Dixieland Brass standing in BC at Flying Horse Farms or if you wanted to look a little bit at the sire's in the Pac North go to www.cthsbc.org and looked at the sires list in the drop down menus.
Ryeno
"The easiest way to end up with a million dollars in the horseracing business is to start with 3 million!"
On paper Cahill Road looks like a pretty nice match with this mare, provided she is not too large and coarse physically and is reasonably correct in the forelegs (he's a big guy and bowed a tendon in his 6th start). If you are willing to ship up into British Columbia, Dixieland Brass (a Dixieland Band son) might also match up well. Both these horses have been in the stud a fair while, so you shouldn't have any trouble getting a look at some of what they're throwing and getting opinions from local folks as to their temperaments and developmental tendencies.
"A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher...You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God: or else a madman or something worse." C. S. Lewis
I highly recommend the Colorado stallion Parade Ground for this mare.
It brings in both the Miesque-Kingmambo/Private Account nick (see the French Classic Winners East of the Moon and Bluemamba); AND the very strong nick between Hail To Reason and His Majesty (see the GIWs Dynaformer; Colonial Waters; Grass Wonder; Wonder Again; Largavita; Country Tyrone; 2-Time Melbourne Cup Winning Filly Makybe Diva; Champion European Sprinter Mozart; Shadwell Turf Mile [GI] and French Classic Winner Landseer; Emerald Dream; Australian Oaks Winner Sunday Joy; Forbidden Apple; Malibu, Santa Anita Handicap and Pimlico Special winner Southern Image; and the Canadian Champion Hero's Love).
Note that two champions (Mozart and Hero's Love) have His Majesty, Hail To Reason, and Graustark (and these three would also be found in Parade Ground-New Account as Graustark is found in Kingmambo's dam Miesque).
-llbean
It brings in both the Miesque-Kingmambo/Private Account nick (see the French Classic Winners East of the Moon and Bluemamba); AND the very strong nick between Hail To Reason and His Majesty (see the GIWs Dynaformer; Colonial Waters; Grass Wonder; Wonder Again; Largavita; Country Tyrone; 2-Time Melbourne Cup Winning Filly Makybe Diva; Champion European Sprinter Mozart; Shadwell Turf Mile [GI] and French Classic Winner Landseer; Emerald Dream; Australian Oaks Winner Sunday Joy; Forbidden Apple; Malibu, Santa Anita Handicap and Pimlico Special winner Southern Image; and the Canadian Champion Hero's Love).
Note that two champions (Mozart and Hero's Love) have His Majesty, Hail To Reason, and Graustark (and these three would also be found in Parade Ground-New Account as Graustark is found in Kingmambo's dam Miesque).
-llbean
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tough hombre
- Weanling
- Posts: 43
- Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 8:46 pm
- Location: Mt.Vernon Ar.
- Contact:
Knac, just remember that the stud fee is the cheapest part of the race horse.
It cost just as much to keep and breed cheap horses as it does good ones. I should Know
.I know it's a long way from the Utah to Ky. but I will bet that with Wild Zone coming to Ky. he will be hotter than ever at the sales. Also you can run your own Werk nick Ratings, many farms list their horses for free. Just remember a nick is not a guarantee just a tool..
Tom
It cost just as much to keep and breed cheap horses as it does good ones. I should Know
.I know it's a long way from the Utah to Ky. but I will bet that with Wild Zone coming to Ky. he will be hotter than ever at the sales. Also you can run your own Werk nick Ratings, many farms list their horses for free. Just remember a nick is not a guarantee just a tool..
Tom
Information on Starmaniac.
If you want to breed to Starmaniac in Idaho my cousins names are Kevin and Kandi Knudson. Their email address is [email protected]. Starmaniac- In France, 2nd Criterium des Deux Ans [G2], Prix Eclipse [G3], Prix du la Huderie,Prix du-Neuf, Prix de Pontarme.In NA. 4th Belmont Jaipur H. [G3].Starmaniac is by Septieme Ciel-Silver Lane by Silver Hawk. He is a half brother to Black Hawk by Nureyev-Silver Lane by Silver Hawk
Winnings: 28 Starts: 9 - 8 - 6, $5,750,386 (USA)(\652,670,000)
Yasuda Kinen (JPN-G1),1600m Sprinters Stakes (JPN-G1),1200m Swan Stakes (JPN-G2),1400m Hankyu Hai (JPN-G3),1200m Lord Derby Challenge Stakes (JPN-G3),1200m 2nd Takamatsunomiya Kinen (G1),1200m CBC Sho (G2), 1200m, Keio Hai Spring Cup G2, Sekiya Kinen G3, Centaur S G3, Hankyu Hai G3. 3rd Mile Championship G1, Sprinters S G1, Keio Hai Spring Cup G2, Keisei Hai Autumn H/C G3.
Entered Stud in 2002, Standing at Eliza Park , Victoria. Stud Fee $13750 t
Starmaniac is out of a full sister to Hawkster and by Septieme Ciel a son of Seattle Slew who is bred similar to Malibu Moon being from the same mare and sire line. Crossed with your mare would be 4x5x6 Hail to Reason 5x5 Swaps 4x6 Round Table and 5x6 on the great broodmare Glamour.
Keith
Winnings: 28 Starts: 9 - 8 - 6, $5,750,386 (USA)(\652,670,000)
Yasuda Kinen (JPN-G1),1600m Sprinters Stakes (JPN-G1),1200m Swan Stakes (JPN-G2),1400m Hankyu Hai (JPN-G3),1200m Lord Derby Challenge Stakes (JPN-G3),1200m 2nd Takamatsunomiya Kinen (G1),1200m CBC Sho (G2), 1200m, Keio Hai Spring Cup G2, Sekiya Kinen G3, Centaur S G3, Hankyu Hai G3. 3rd Mile Championship G1, Sprinters S G1, Keio Hai Spring Cup G2, Keisei Hai Autumn H/C G3.
Entered Stud in 2002, Standing at Eliza Park , Victoria. Stud Fee $13750 t
Starmaniac is out of a full sister to Hawkster and by Septieme Ciel a son of Seattle Slew who is bred similar to Malibu Moon being from the same mare and sire line. Crossed with your mare would be 4x5x6 Hail to Reason 5x5 Swaps 4x6 Round Table and 5x6 on the great broodmare Glamour.
Keith
Several stallions up your way.
1. Persian Turban by Sadlers Well-Charming Tiara by Alydar unraced and out of a half sister to Seattle Slew $1,250 Stud Fee Idaho
2. Fabulous Frolic by Green Dancer-Cherokee Frolic by Cherokee Fellow $1,500 Stud Fee winner of the Gr. III Tropical Park Derby and Idaho's leading sire in 2004
3. Reno City by Fappiano-Sefa's Beauty by Lt. Stevens $750 stud fee Idaho
4. Unbridled Desire by Unbridled-Gold'n' Desire by Gold and Myrrh New York allowance winner $1,000 Stud fee Montana
5. Taillevent by Unbridled's Song=Number's Game by Soy Numero Uno $1,000 Stud fee Utah
Keith
2. Fabulous Frolic by Green Dancer-Cherokee Frolic by Cherokee Fellow $1,500 Stud Fee winner of the Gr. III Tropical Park Derby and Idaho's leading sire in 2004
3. Reno City by Fappiano-Sefa's Beauty by Lt. Stevens $750 stud fee Idaho
4. Unbridled Desire by Unbridled-Gold'n' Desire by Gold and Myrrh New York allowance winner $1,000 Stud fee Montana
5. Taillevent by Unbridled's Song=Number's Game by Soy Numero Uno $1,000 Stud fee Utah
Keith
knac,
As you know, your mare is not only bred for distance racing, but has produced foals which mostly prefer two turns. Both Private Account and Good Counsel were excellent racehorses at 10 furlongs. Since racing at Emerald Downs/Hastings Park is decidedly biased towards races at a mile and under, you may want to consider injecting more speed into New Account's foal. If you breed her to a distance type horse, such as Cahill Road, you run the risk of producing a plodder which cannot compete in your region.
I don't recall if you offered a description of the mare's conformation, but again you must take this into consideration when you choose a stallion. If she is a large mare who generally produces big foals, you may want to breed her down a bit. Again, a large horse like Cahill Road (who is certainly a nice horse) may not fit this mare if she is of like type.
I think if the mare were mine, and I was breeding to race, I would limit my choices to stallions which are likely to produce sound racehorses best suited to middle distances. A good middle distance horse can shorten up and stretch out better than a horse which is heavily biased towards one extreme or the other.
I would also suggest that you make your final selection ONLY after visiting each horse. Making long term and expensive breeding decisions on the basis of "paper matings" alone often results in unattractive, non-athletic foals. And the ultimate goal of any home breeder is to create money making athletes who last a long time.
As you know, your mare is not only bred for distance racing, but has produced foals which mostly prefer two turns. Both Private Account and Good Counsel were excellent racehorses at 10 furlongs. Since racing at Emerald Downs/Hastings Park is decidedly biased towards races at a mile and under, you may want to consider injecting more speed into New Account's foal. If you breed her to a distance type horse, such as Cahill Road, you run the risk of producing a plodder which cannot compete in your region.
I don't recall if you offered a description of the mare's conformation, but again you must take this into consideration when you choose a stallion. If she is a large mare who generally produces big foals, you may want to breed her down a bit. Again, a large horse like Cahill Road (who is certainly a nice horse) may not fit this mare if she is of like type.
I think if the mare were mine, and I was breeding to race, I would limit my choices to stallions which are likely to produce sound racehorses best suited to middle distances. A good middle distance horse can shorten up and stretch out better than a horse which is heavily biased towards one extreme or the other.
I would also suggest that you make your final selection ONLY after visiting each horse. Making long term and expensive breeding decisions on the basis of "paper matings" alone often results in unattractive, non-athletic foals. And the ultimate goal of any home breeder is to create money making athletes who last a long time.