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How can I balance my 17h mare...

Posted: Sun Dec 01, 2013 11:25 pm
by 3nutmeg
I have a 17h mare, medium/large long framed. I've seen 2 of her foals(1pic)2 different stallions. I don't know how tall the sires were. She seems to throw LARGE, BIG kneed foals. NA bred on top European grass on the bottom. I would like to breed to race and I understand that her foals will be late bloomers and would run on grass or over hurdles. I think turf racing is exciting. My question is how do I/can I balance out my mare? What kind of stallion should I look for? Height, physical type, dirt/grass? I'm in the NY/PA area. Do you have any suggestions for NY/PA or third choice KY?

Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 3:20 pm
by Jeff
Find a small stallion, or a horse known to throw smaller sized offpring would be the thing to do. I'm not familiar with
which stallions might be able to produce a more average sized foal with a mare known to throw 17handers, but I'm sure they're out there. Rahy was a smaller size, threw some smaller offspring, maybe some Rahy close up in the pedigree would help. Some of the Danzig's are of a smaller stature too, like Northern Dancer.

Go visit some stud farms now and look at the weanlings out in the pasture, ask "who's that little runt by"? Breed the mare to his daddy :D

Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 4:12 pm
by CherryDavis
If you are close to NY, look at Justenuffhumor. Successful grass horse, excellent pedigree(direct family of Kittens Joy), nicely compact and well balanced. I have a foal by him and have looked at others. All but one were very nice, on the smaller side, very well balanced foals. The one that didn't fit the profile looked to me like it could have been because of some sort of human interference like too much high fat grain, still had a nice hip and shoulder under all the bulk. I'm disappointed that he is not getting more support, especially after seeing my foal who is very correct and athletic.

Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 9:31 pm
by Joltman
There are studies that recommend against changing the type of the stallion vs the mare. If the foal has a cannon bone from his sire and the weight of his dam, it won't be good. Certainly something 16+ but maybe a little smaller with all the other considerations.

I've wondered about Justenoughhumor as I really liked my Lewis Michael foal. Same kind of nice, balanced look but not brawny.

If Alphabet Soup were still in NY he would get a vote - very solid though maybe a tad small. While opportunities to run long are fewer - there are fewer authentic stayers and if you get a good one, you can clean up. The BC Marathon seems to have ex-claimers taking a shot and sometimes doing just fine.

jm

Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:14 pm
by kimberley mine
Not sure of your budget or the mare's pedigree, but take a good look at Freud.

He's producing quality AND some distance on turf and on synth...2 Gr-2 winners on synth, about 3 Gr-3 winners on turf at 1 1/16, and one that finished second to Presious Passion at a mile and a half on the lawn at Calder.

would you consider these?

Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 1:25 pm
by 3nutmeg
Would you consider one of these stallions? Maybry's Boy, Justenuffhumor, Sir Shackleton?

Here's a comparison of the three, Maybry's Boy, Justenuffhumor and Sir Shackleton.

http://www.bloodhorse.com/stallion-regi ... ree=135093

The mare is solid built. Her body type is more like Maybry's Boy. Maybry's Boy hasn't had a lot of foals. I don't know how tall any of these guys are or what type they produce.

The mare didn't anything at the track. She was a late bloomer and has pinfire/cryo marks so that may have been a factor. I like her dam's side. I'm not breeding to sell.
Her pedigree.

http://www.pedigreequery.com/fashion+verdict2

She was owned by : Beverly R. Steinman.

Thanks for your input and suggestions

Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:40 pm
by Joltman
Quiet American is a premier bm sire and a lot to like/work with there. With no Northern Dancer, maybe consider some thing one of those Euro types like Sadlers Wells (El Prado) line or Giants Causeway. The best of the GCs proven in NY is Frost Giant, but Giant Surprise might be a good roll of the dice (adding some speed?)

jm

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 5:15 am
by CherryDavis
I would not consider Sir Shackleton, or at least go and see him first. I can't find my notes on him, but I'm pretty sure in person he is very upright and overly long backed.

Posted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 2:48 am
by kimberley mine
Joltman wrote:Quiet American is a premier bm sire and a lot to like/work with there. With no Northern Dancer, maybe consider some thing one of those Euro types like Sadlers Wells (El Prado) line or Giants Causeway. The best of the GCs proven in NY is Frost Giant, but Giant Surprise might be a good roll of the dice (adding some speed?)

jm


I think Joltman's on to something with the Giant's Causeway line. GC himself is the sire of Gr-1 winning chasers Gustavian and Arcadius, and his son First Samurai is the sire of a Gr-1 winning chaser this year. Clearly there's some talent over fences there.

Giant Surprise--for a chaser I would AVOID. His stallion photograph shows a really funky looking left front, plus he had exactly one start.

Frost Giant is getting winners, and is priced accordingly--but for $10k and that bloodline, I'd go to Freud, who does not have the close cross of Mr P.

Fairbanks in Pennsylvania is off to a decent start, fairly priced, and free of Mr P. For the record I'm think that doubling up on Mr P isn't necessarily a bad thing, but the direct cross of Giant's Causeway and Fappiano sons/grandsons is so good that why mess with a good thing?