Clever Strategy-won her races at 5-61/2 furlongs
4 foals that were sired by the following- Canyon Creek(ages 5 and 6) Perigee Moon(3 year old) and Bold Executive(yearling)
The only one to race so far is sired by Canyon Creek-now a four year old filly Canyon Strategy and a money earner.
I would like to see her put to speed again-I really like the looks of her Bold Executive yearling-and was thinking of a Geiger Counter son-Parisianprospector. I am limited to Ontario-really dont want to be shipping her all over the place.
So any other suggestions or lines I should be looking towards would be very much appreciated.
suggestions on this mare...
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lotsahorsin
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louis finochio
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This pedigree of Clever Strategy is an example of soundness in our modern day TB.
CS has 15 crosses of non-(Phalaris) and 1 cross of (Phalaris) thru Nearco.
CS made 55 lifetime starts and won her share of races. Congrats to your mare CS for her will to win and further evidence of the soundness those non-(Phalaris) sire lines add to our TB soundness.
CS has 15 crosses of non-(Phalaris) and 1 cross of (Phalaris) thru Nearco.
CS made 55 lifetime starts and won her share of races. Congrats to your mare CS for her will to win and further evidence of the soundness those non-(Phalaris) sire lines add to our TB soundness.
Those without sin cast the first stone.
Louis Finochio
Louis Finochio
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lotsahorsin
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louis finochio
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Your mare CS is golden, as 99 % of the breed has 7 to 12 crosses of (Phalaris) within their 5 generation pedigree.
You can breed your mare to any of the (Phalaris) sire line stallions and expect to carry on the soundness of your mare to her foals.
The sire line of (Phalaris) a foal of 1913 is alive and well in todays time frame. Congrats on your mares golden pedigree as many breeders would love to have her in their broodmare band.
You can breed your mare to any of the (Phalaris) sire line stallions and expect to carry on the soundness of your mare to her foals.
The sire line of (Phalaris) a foal of 1913 is alive and well in todays time frame. Congrats on your mares golden pedigree as many breeders would love to have her in their broodmare band.
Those without sin cast the first stone.
Louis Finochio
Louis Finochio
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lotsahorsin
- Weanling
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lotsahorsin, are you looking to sell or race the foal?
Legal Jousting (Indian Ridge X In Anticipation - Sadler's Wells) standing at Kingsgate Stud
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lotsahorsin
- Weanling
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If you are looking to sell through the CTHS sale I don't think Parisianprospector is the way to go. Are you looking for stallions in the same stud fee range? Higher?
Impeachment looks like a bargain at $1500, Lodge Hill was a nice racehorse and stands for $2000, I'd invite you to have a look at my stallion Legal Jousting as well (just click on the link in my signature line) $3500.
Impeachment looks like a bargain at $1500, Lodge Hill was a nice racehorse and stands for $2000, I'd invite you to have a look at my stallion Legal Jousting as well (just click on the link in my signature line) $3500.
Legal Jousting (Indian Ridge X In Anticipation - Sadler's Wells) standing at Kingsgate Stud
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lotsahorsin
- Weanling
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When basing my looking around I have looked at the amount and quality of mares that have been bred to stallions. I am looking for a 2nd to 3 rd year stallion-whichis why I am looking at sprinting lines-more likely to start as 2 year olds.
It is senseless to breed to a stallion who has not had a good book of mares with either proven producers or money earners themselves-raises the chances of having a more recognisable sire for this future yearling-especially when wanting to market as a yearling sales horse.
I look at Parisianprospector becuase he ran well and earned well-his first foals are this year and it is a very recognisable line when going to the sales. I have worked with numerous horses with those bloodlines(top and bottom) to recognise the faults in each-and recognising that my mare does not have them-so ups the chances of having a good sound foal.
I like the GC's and GG's and steer a little cleer of the Bold Ruckus if they have a certain mare line. Hopefully I will have my decision made by the end of next week to get her off to the shed.
I hadn't planned on breeding her TB-but no one was interested in buying her-so I will.
It is senseless to breed to a stallion who has not had a good book of mares with either proven producers or money earners themselves-raises the chances of having a more recognisable sire for this future yearling-especially when wanting to market as a yearling sales horse.
I look at Parisianprospector becuase he ran well and earned well-his first foals are this year and it is a very recognisable line when going to the sales. I have worked with numerous horses with those bloodlines(top and bottom) to recognise the faults in each-and recognising that my mare does not have them-so ups the chances of having a good sound foal.
I like the GC's and GG's and steer a little cleer of the Bold Ruckus if they have a certain mare line. Hopefully I will have my decision made by the end of next week to get her off to the shed.
I hadn't planned on breeding her TB-but no one was interested in buying her-so I will.
lotsahorsin, Parisianprospector has crops that are running.
From the Brisnet Free Stallion Directory:
LEADING RUNNERS:
Wholelottaspirit (2003 G, by WAR DEPUTY) Winner at 2, $7,854, in NA.
Parisian Jade (2003 F, by JADE HUNTER) Placed at 2, $4,749, in NA.
Parisian Princess (2003 F, by BOLD EXECUTIVE) Placed at 2, $2,380, in NA.
All Parisian (2003 G, by ROCKY MOUNTAIN) Unplaced at 2, $682, in NA.
Paris In The Sing (2003 F, by LORD AVIE) Unplaced at 2, $336, in NA.
In 2004 his yearling sales results were
2 fillies sold for an average of $929
2 colts sold for an average of $1,627
All figures are in US Funds.
I think you would do better to have a look for a different stallion. A good place to start would be http://www.canadianthoroughbred.com, they have most of the better stallions and their statistics listed. I would also suggest that you actually go out and visit some of these stallions. When I was looking at stallions a couple years ago, ones that I were really excited about were certainly a dissapointment when I actually got to see them in the flesh.
From the Brisnet Free Stallion Directory:
LEADING RUNNERS:
Wholelottaspirit (2003 G, by WAR DEPUTY) Winner at 2, $7,854, in NA.
Parisian Jade (2003 F, by JADE HUNTER) Placed at 2, $4,749, in NA.
Parisian Princess (2003 F, by BOLD EXECUTIVE) Placed at 2, $2,380, in NA.
All Parisian (2003 G, by ROCKY MOUNTAIN) Unplaced at 2, $682, in NA.
Paris In The Sing (2003 F, by LORD AVIE) Unplaced at 2, $336, in NA.
In 2004 his yearling sales results were
2 fillies sold for an average of $929
2 colts sold for an average of $1,627
All figures are in US Funds.
I think you would do better to have a look for a different stallion. A good place to start would be http://www.canadianthoroughbred.com, they have most of the better stallions and their statistics listed. I would also suggest that you actually go out and visit some of these stallions. When I was looking at stallions a couple years ago, ones that I were really excited about were certainly a dissapointment when I actually got to see them in the flesh.
Legal Jousting (Indian Ridge X In Anticipation - Sadler's Wells) standing at Kingsgate Stud
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lotsahorsin
- Weanling
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- Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 2:45 am
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Thanks-I did try to get back and correct that mistake lastnight-but my computer went all screwy-but yes I know his oldest are 3 year olds.
And thanks for the Canadian TB-I have also been doing my homework by seeing how many mares a stud has been breeding in Ontario-the mares they have bred etc.
No one seems to have any opinion on a shorter running stud in Ontario. It is just my preference to breed to a sprinter.
And thanks for the Canadian TB-I have also been doing my homework by seeing how many mares a stud has been breeding in Ontario-the mares they have bred etc.
No one seems to have any opinion on a shorter running stud in Ontario. It is just my preference to breed to a sprinter.
Hi Lotsahorsin,
I have no idea why you would want a stone sprinter to a sprinter, (exclusively and as a strategy), and potentially eliminate half the races that your foal might be able to compete in. Breeding to brilliance is fine but unless there was another set of compelling reasons other than sprinting as an aptitude, I'd broaden my view some.
A few stallions in Ontario to consider:
Trajectory had a solid showing from his first crop in 2005 including 2 SWs. His sales prices have been acceptable (his fee was $3,000/CDN) and are a good bet to improve. Your race season starts 4/1 (WO) and I think Trajectory will continue to make some noise. His sire line (Gone West) is solid commercially.
Trajectory won stakes at middle distances but had some quality sprinting. On Belmont day, 2000, Trippi won the Riva Ridge S. @7f in 1:23.2 but there was a better 7f 3yo race on the card, won in 1:23.0 by Left Bank (G1), Trajectory was 2nd, Valiant Halory 3rd and Peeping Tom (G1) 4th. ($5,000/CDN, Gardiner Farms, ON).
A Fleet's Dancer is another stallion prospect you might consider. A solid performer on the track, his foals have gotten some attention at the sales. His first foals hit the track this year. ($5,000/CDN, Gardiner Farms, ON).
Tethra is a solid race horse sire that sells moderately well in Canadian sales. Not a lot of stakes winners but he gets more than his share of Woodbine Allowance (Ontario Sire restricted allowances too) races. ($3,000/CDN, Winfields Farm, ON).
Whiskey Wisdom gets some nice class winners but a low percentage of them (winners) and he can be a bear at the sales. I'd go elsewhere.
Ascot Knight is an old boy with a long and respectable record. His fee has been coming down while his sales prices have only slipped moderately. A superior mating on paper with an inside cross on the exceptional FULL sisters, Bambee T. T. and Kankanee Miss (thus 3x4 Better Bee/Golden Miss). This mating also brings in the first of Northern Dancer's blood and the pedigree content is excellent. Despite the inbreeding the foal will have more unique blood than most horses out crossed through 5 generations. ($3,500/CDN, Winfield Farm, ON).
There are 2 Young sons of Mr. Prospector standing in Ontario;
Paynes Bay, a son of Mr. Prospector was a $1,600,000 yearling out of the excellent Seattle Slew mare, Embellished. He obviously has (had) looks, pedigree and some talent but never got black-type. A 4x4 inside cross on Never Bend (preferred placement). ($2,500/CDN, Norse Ridge Farm, ON).
Dance To Destiny is similar to Paynes Bay but with an even better pedigree and race record. G3 placed an in the money in all 11 starts. 5x4 bottom line cross on Nodouble, this sire is genetically (very) similar to Smart Strike ($50,000/US) ($5,000/CDN, Colebrook Farms, ON).
Just about all sons of Mr. Prospector have the potential to become decent stallions and good looking foals may be solid sales individuals. The unproven NOT FOR LOVE ($3,500/US) had a first crop 2yo sell for $2,150,000.
Mr. Jester was an exceptional 2yo (G3 winner) of over $750,000. Silver Deputy has been a superior sire but is an unknown as a sire of sires. Some quality in the pedigree going back to Nalee. Solid outcross introducing Northern Dancer blood. Nice on paper, unknown at the sales. It might be better to wait and see how his foals look and piggy-back any success that they have in the sales. ($3,000/CDN, Colebrook Farms, ON).
I would most highly recommend Ascot Knight because he's completely proven, reasonably priced, respectable at the auctions and an excellent match in pedigree. Check Ascot Knight's his fertility, his book is diminished in size but his fertility seems ok. Checking any stallion's fertility is a good idea actually.
My second choice would be Trajectory and Dance To Destiny as an unproven stallion (if he's a fraction of the sire that Smart Strike is he'll be exceptional in Canada but this is his first crop). A Fleets Dancer's potential for you is in his upcoming runners (ahead of your foal), 41 in 2006 and 34 in 2007.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Pete
I have no idea why you would want a stone sprinter to a sprinter, (exclusively and as a strategy), and potentially eliminate half the races that your foal might be able to compete in. Breeding to brilliance is fine but unless there was another set of compelling reasons other than sprinting as an aptitude, I'd broaden my view some.
A few stallions in Ontario to consider:
Trajectory had a solid showing from his first crop in 2005 including 2 SWs. His sales prices have been acceptable (his fee was $3,000/CDN) and are a good bet to improve. Your race season starts 4/1 (WO) and I think Trajectory will continue to make some noise. His sire line (Gone West) is solid commercially.
Trajectory won stakes at middle distances but had some quality sprinting. On Belmont day, 2000, Trippi won the Riva Ridge S. @7f in 1:23.2 but there was a better 7f 3yo race on the card, won in 1:23.0 by Left Bank (G1), Trajectory was 2nd, Valiant Halory 3rd and Peeping Tom (G1) 4th. ($5,000/CDN, Gardiner Farms, ON).
A Fleet's Dancer is another stallion prospect you might consider. A solid performer on the track, his foals have gotten some attention at the sales. His first foals hit the track this year. ($5,000/CDN, Gardiner Farms, ON).
Tethra is a solid race horse sire that sells moderately well in Canadian sales. Not a lot of stakes winners but he gets more than his share of Woodbine Allowance (Ontario Sire restricted allowances too) races. ($3,000/CDN, Winfields Farm, ON).
Whiskey Wisdom gets some nice class winners but a low percentage of them (winners) and he can be a bear at the sales. I'd go elsewhere.
Ascot Knight is an old boy with a long and respectable record. His fee has been coming down while his sales prices have only slipped moderately. A superior mating on paper with an inside cross on the exceptional FULL sisters, Bambee T. T. and Kankanee Miss (thus 3x4 Better Bee/Golden Miss). This mating also brings in the first of Northern Dancer's blood and the pedigree content is excellent. Despite the inbreeding the foal will have more unique blood than most horses out crossed through 5 generations. ($3,500/CDN, Winfield Farm, ON).
There are 2 Young sons of Mr. Prospector standing in Ontario;
Paynes Bay, a son of Mr. Prospector was a $1,600,000 yearling out of the excellent Seattle Slew mare, Embellished. He obviously has (had) looks, pedigree and some talent but never got black-type. A 4x4 inside cross on Never Bend (preferred placement). ($2,500/CDN, Norse Ridge Farm, ON).
Dance To Destiny is similar to Paynes Bay but with an even better pedigree and race record. G3 placed an in the money in all 11 starts. 5x4 bottom line cross on Nodouble, this sire is genetically (very) similar to Smart Strike ($50,000/US) ($5,000/CDN, Colebrook Farms, ON).
Just about all sons of Mr. Prospector have the potential to become decent stallions and good looking foals may be solid sales individuals. The unproven NOT FOR LOVE ($3,500/US) had a first crop 2yo sell for $2,150,000.
Mr. Jester was an exceptional 2yo (G3 winner) of over $750,000. Silver Deputy has been a superior sire but is an unknown as a sire of sires. Some quality in the pedigree going back to Nalee. Solid outcross introducing Northern Dancer blood. Nice on paper, unknown at the sales. It might be better to wait and see how his foals look and piggy-back any success that they have in the sales. ($3,000/CDN, Colebrook Farms, ON).
I would most highly recommend Ascot Knight because he's completely proven, reasonably priced, respectable at the auctions and an excellent match in pedigree. Check Ascot Knight's his fertility, his book is diminished in size but his fertility seems ok. Checking any stallion's fertility is a good idea actually.
My second choice would be Trajectory and Dance To Destiny as an unproven stallion (if he's a fraction of the sire that Smart Strike is he'll be exceptional in Canada but this is his first crop). A Fleets Dancer's potential for you is in his upcoming runners (ahead of your foal), 41 in 2006 and 34 in 2007.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Pete
Has a palomino jean that pop up some.
This stallion is DNA ... all foal can be MBNA inrolled.
Horses like their credit cards. - Four Forty Farms
This stallion is DNA ... all foal can be MBNA inrolled.
Horses like their credit cards. - Four Forty Farms
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louis finochio
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Parisianprospector has 6 crosses of the Phalaris sire line in his 5 generation pedigree.
Parisianprospector few crosses of Phalaris is better that stallions that have 10-13 crosses, as those stallions are bred to mares that have 8-12 crosses of Phalaris.
Parisianprospector few crosses of Phalaris is better that stallions that have 10-13 crosses, as those stallions are bred to mares that have 8-12 crosses of Phalaris.
Those without sin cast the first stone.
Louis Finochio
Louis Finochio
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lotsahorsin
- Weanling
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Thank you so much Pete I appreciate your information. Well most certainly this mare will not be going back to Gardiners(end of story) but I had looked at Dance to Destiny as well as another of the Dance Smartly offspring.
I am very surprised to see Ascot Knights stud fee come down-and that reasonable too. I have always been a fan of his-just figured he was unobtainable at a much higher stud fee. That would be a most exceptional cross.
And I agree on the Silver Deputy end...but it seems now that he has been pulled form the Ontario market that everyone has hopes of "this or that" son being his replacement.
Again thank you for the info.
I am very surprised to see Ascot Knights stud fee come down-and that reasonable too. I have always been a fan of his-just figured he was unobtainable at a much higher stud fee. That would be a most exceptional cross.
And I agree on the Silver Deputy end...but it seems now that he has been pulled form the Ontario market that everyone has hopes of "this or that" son being his replacement.
Again thank you for the info.