OK, here's a Jeopardy question - Awful Sires for $400, Alex:

[Rokeby Forever]

What first crop to race sire has 113 foals in the crop, 1 multiple winner in 40 foals to race, 5 winners (4%), no SWs, $713 in median earnings/starter, and an AEI of 0.27?

The answer? Buddha!

Now, after you stop thinking that these stats come from the Twilight Zone, ask yourself - how in the world can this horse stand for $10,000 next year?

My guess is that people that have been shelling out over $36,000 average/yearling for a Buddha are feeling a bit punchy right now.

The Unbridled's Song stallion beat goes on.......

[KAL]

Careful... I was quite critical of him in his first year... then again after his first babies hit the ground... and his defenders were many and vocal.

At one point, I actually thought I had made a wrong turn on the information superhighway and had offended an entire religious order... but then I realized the monks would have been far more gracious and understanding.

So, I can again offend... I thought he was an over-hyped, unsound racehorse. I thought he was an overpriced, overhyped, poorly conformed young sire from a line which has not yet proven to replicate success. Now, I find him to be an overhyped, statistically inferior, and basically overpriced stallion, who should be avoided except those who firmly believe they have the right mare to turn him around.

However, he is still young and he does only have a limited amount of foals to hit the track... so, he may yet to prove to be the real deal (and make me eat my words)... or he may prove to be a complete and dismal failure.

I'll take bets that Candy Ride proves to be the better of the two, although he had almost no hype, has had a lower fee, and his foals will probably have a lower sales average.

[Rokeby Forever]

Kal, Candy Ride was a very crooked horse, which is what shortened what may have been a spectacular career. My worry with him is that his foals will be just as crooked and won't have nearly the talent.

By 2nd choice for young bust of the year is Yonaguska. He's another overbred Coolmore Xerox machine, and his numbers look it. Of 106 foals in his first crop, he's got 50% starters but only one stakes winner. For an early sprinter like he was, I doubt that his offspring will improve over time....so I'm led to believe that he's siring a lot of cheap horses (AEI = 0.79, CI = 1.38). I'm not so sure I'd fork over $10,000 to Magnier and Tabor for the priviledge of booking a mare to him. There are some young stallions out there like Vision And Verse and Behrens that seem to be devoid of any genetic material, but their stud fees are a lot less...somewhere in the $5,000 range, I believe.

[geowarrior]

Vison and Verse, Behrens and Buddha are all in the American Thoroughbred Review's (as yet incomplete) list of worst values for 2007.

[Jean]

Hill and Dale does a lot of hype on new stallions. How are their stallions turning out overall. Stormy Atlantic seems to be a success.

[Mood Swings]

Kal, Candy Ride was a very crooked horse, which is what shortened what may have been a spectacular career. My worry with him is that his foals will be just as crooked and won't have nearly the talent.

So far the Candy Ride's that I have seen have been magnificent. Correct, nice bodied and average + in the height department.

As far as sales results go - at the OBS sale in October . . . hip #286 $75,000, hip # 357 $105,000 and hip # 691 was RNA'd at $37,000. That's an verage of $90,000 - not bad for a $10,000 stud fee.
- at the November Breeding Stock sale in Ky with 9 weanlings selling for an average of $61,166 not too shabby.

[Rokeby Forever]

Hi Jean. Of the Hill N'Dale stallions that come to mind, I think Mutakddim is a good value at $12,500 - 55% of his foals are winners, he has 8% SWs, and his AEI is a pretty good 1.95 compared to his CI. Stormy Atlantic is a useful sire, but for $30,000, his numbers aren't nearly as good as Mutakddim's. Vindications, by accounts I've read or heard, are really nice looking foals and they sold well throughout 2006, and I haven't heard a thing about the Roman Rulers. I think El Corridor is still standing there (not positive about that), but if he is, my impression is that the market has cooled off on him - I remember a time when many people were looking forward to his foals, but I don't hear the same chatter about the horse any more.

[KAL]

Funny, don't remember Candy Ride being crooked and notes don't show any concern in that regard... and we sent mares to him. His feet were his problem and what led to limited races... and I would not send a mare with questionable or small feet to him.

Thanks for the info on the Candy Ride foals... I would love to see the ones we were responsible for (we sold the mares in foal). One in particular I think will be very, very useful.

To my knowledge, Tabor and Magnier don't own Vinery, which is where Yonaguska stands. I don't even think the Coolmore bunch even kept a piece of him. From what I understand, Yonaguska's first book was weaker than his second, so I cannot write him off at this point. Besides, Vinery has done pretty well with More Than Ready and Pure Prize, and even Brahms is showing life (and he had similar books to Yonaguska... better in his second and third year).

El Corredor is in fact at Hill n Dale and he is doing quite well. In fact, I think he has had a couple fee increases. I liked him enough to send a mare to him a couple years ago. I hear the foal is Immaculate (or something like that). Overall, I think Hill n Dale has some of the most exciting young stallions... and they lost a couple interesting ones as well (Saarland and Medaglia d'oro). However, Buddha is not one I would have ever considered.

[Rokeby Forever]

Hi Kal...thanks for filling me in on Yonaguska. I didn't know that Coolmore unloaded him. The Vinery might be overbreeding More Than Ready now, shuttling him to Australia on the off season - he was a well kept secret as being a good turf sire, but I guess the cat is now out of the bag.

As I recall, Candy Ride was something like a $2,000 yearling that was very incorrect. Jenny and Sid Craig purchased the horse when he showed some real ability in South America, but I seem to recall comments about his being crooked. He may well have have bad feet, but I don't remember hearing that about him.

You're absolutely right about Pure Prize. The one thing I remember about him racing was that he was a moody horse - he'd fire on certain days but not others. For some reason, Shug McGaughey seems to wind up with a lot of looney tunes (Coronado's Quest, the whole Personal Ensign line...), and he was no exception.

His dam, Heavenly Prize, was a mare that I really liked. She was overshadowed by Inside Information, but she was a beautiful mare, very sound and durable (for a Seeking The Gold) from what I understand. His bottom side is certainly strong enough for him to continue to be a successful sire...unlike several of the 1,000 Storm Cats that are polluting the landscape at a $2,500 fee.

[Mood Swings]

Hi Jean. Of the Hill N'Dale stallions that come to mind, I think Mutakddim is a good value at $12,500 - 55% of his foals are winners, he has 8% SWs, and his AEI is a pretty good 1.95 compared to his CI. Stormy Atlantic is a useful sire, but for $30,000, his numbers aren't nearly as good as Mutakddim's. Vindications, by accounts I've read or heard, are really nice looking foals and they sold well throughout 2006, and I haven't heard a thing about the Roman Rulers. I think El Corridor is still standing there (not positive about that), but if he is, my impression is that the market has cooled off on him - I remember a time when many people were looking forward to his foals, but I don't hear the same chatter about the horse any more.

Mutakddim is very popular in the Ontario market his yearling sale average was $101,750 (CTHS Sept Select) and for good reason - he throws very athletic and usefull horses. Roman Ruler's first foals won't hit the ground until 2007 his "in foal mares" sold well in KY and I'm sure they will be popular in the sales ring as well. It will be interesting to see how Vindication pans out this year with his first crop of 2 year olds. One can't forget the great Theatrical, beaten only by Storm Cat for higher number of G1 winners in North America

[Rokeby Forever]

I'm not high on Vindication as a stud simply because he didn't last long himself - not that he was predisposed to unsoundness, but he didn't race at 3.

If I wanted to take a shot on an unproven sire, I'd look to Congaree. Tough, durable, consistent, classy, and if bumblin' Bob Baffert couldn't break him down, he must have been made out of steel. I think he's a pretty good value at $15,000.

[ratherrapid]

hey! watch it on the Vision and Verse slander. i just paid hard earned $$$ for one of those.

[Rokeby Forever]

Vision And Verse slander? Is it slander to point out:

110 foals of racing age
1 SW
AEI = 0.94
CI = 1.41


Let's hope he wasn't bred to the right kinds of mares as of yet.

[pokeyman]

With Candy Ride, didn't you all see the size of his feet??? He has the feet of a yearling on an adult horse body! Yikes!!!!!!!

I believe they just upped Mutakddim's stud fee. Bummer. He's the real deal.....

[pokeyman]

In regard to Vision and Verse, I wouldn't quite give up on him yet.

I think he should stand for $3,500 though...and I wouldn't pay crazy money for his yearlings but would think about taking a chance on a moderate priced one.

He is by a sire of sires (Storm Cat) and out of a mare by one of the top broodmare sires in Private Account. He is also from a sire producing female family being from the family of Stop the Music and Buckaroo-both pretty decent sires.

He was also a credible racehorse and reletively sound (by modern standards).

Plus, about 61% of his kids are hitting the track and 55% of those runners are winning. All decent numbers for a stallion with 2 crops to race and foal crops of 61/44 , respectively. Likewise, I believe out of the stallions mentioned with him, he is also receiving the lowest quality of mares.