Any thoughts about Congaree?

[Rokeby Forever]

At $15,000, I think there's a lot of value with this horse. He was tough, durable, consistent, and classy - one of the best milers of this generation. If bumblin' Bob Baffert couldn't break him down, he had to be made out of steel.

Being by Arazi, he doesn't have a lot of commercial flair, but with grass pedigrees waking up on Polytrack, this horse might be a really good sire if nicked to the appropriate mares.

I'd certainly take him over a 2 year old breakdown, a Storm Cat crooked mess, or a horse like Andromeda's Hero standing for around the same fee.

Any thoughts?

[summerhorse]

I really like him, he was good and had a lot of heart. I'm not sure if he was any tougher than your average good horse or just cursed with an unfashionable pedigree and thus doomed to earn his living (and stud life) the hard way, by actually running!

His bottom line seems a bit light though, wondering if that will hold him back as a sire? And his sire of course was hmmm, somewhat of a disapointment although jet lag might have had something to do with it!

[ASB]

Congaree... one of those horses who earned respect the hard way on the track.

I'll be honest, he doesnt look that great. He's narrow, a touch small, lacks bone, doesnt have a real racey look about him, and really check his feet... they're small and I would suggest running away quickly if your mare has problem feet or is from a line that is known to throw them.

I would feel better about him if he was atypical of his sire, but he's not. He has a world of similarities physically. Its really a shame because he was a good one on the track that deserves a chance...

I've seen some of his foals and there wasnt much to say about them. Even though he is priced well for what he accomplished, remember, there's a reason for that. He's not going to be commercial and you can never call an unproven stallion a good breed-to race candidate, so he is what is he, which unfortunately for such a talented runner, isnt much.

My suggestion-- Respect him for what he was on the track, but stay away until he proves the multitude of variables against him wrong.

I hope im wrong, truly.

[halo]

Small? So is the Bloodhorse lying when he's listed at 16.3?

[ASB]

He's NOT 16'3. Go check him out in person. Dont act like farms dont add some height to their stallions. Height is something you can get away with... especially when you want to seperate him from the memory of his sire. Although, my exact words were a "touch small". He's not tiny by any means, but he's not big either.

Again, i'll repeat, that horse is NOT any part of 16'3. Not that size matters... I'd take a short Rahy over just about any stallion in the bluegrass.

[halo]

Awesome Again must be a midget then, because if you check the T Times videos, the same gentleman is walking both horses, and Congaree is much taller than Awesome Again.

[ASB]

Im telling you, i've seen the horses. I have pictures of every Adena stallion for my mares records... he's not a tall horse and he's no part of 16'3. It really is THAT simple.

I've read your posts, and ignoring your constant one liners, you're pretty informed. Im sure you know the fudging that takes place with stallion heights. Nuff said.

[halo]

I dont have to go see him; I saw him every day for 6 months. Im not saying he's a giant, but I would never have said he's a touch small. Any horse that gets over 16.1 hands is not small to me. But thats just me.

[Rokeby Forever]

These stallion directories are so wrong - the TB Times directory has Point Given standing at 16.2. Gimme a break!!!

And, I can't agree more...give me pony sized Rahy over 99% of the stallions out there (Cozzene being the other).

[Cree]

I saw him in his last year of racing, and he is at most, 16.1 hands. Unless, he's grown since then. I also remember him being a really good-minded horse.

[LSB]

I saw Congaree about a month ago at Adena. I measured him at 16.2.

[KAL]

Hmm... I had him a touch over 16.2... and while I wasn't really impressed with him physically, I would consider him slightly on the tall side. (Anything over a "true" 16.1 qualifies for me... and it is amazing how many listed at 16.1 or 16.0 are really closer to 15.3.)

Not that height really matters, but when you are trying to match the physical attributes and breed away or to certain things, you have to consider such. It all comes down to what I have said time and time and time again... you have to go see the stallion in person. Do your evaluations in person. Evaluate all aspects, in person and without bias.

Now, the same doesn't necessarily hold true for proven stallions like Rahy... but I still would not send him a small mare.

While I am at it... Point Given, while looking huge after one looks at Rahy, is not as big as what we were lead to believe when he was on the track. I had him at a solid 16.3. Actually, I was happy that he wasn't as big as imagined, so we used him and got a fantastic filly (the top selling P.G. weanling in November).

If you want big... track down Evansville Slew and go see Tiznow. See if they will get Tiznow to rear up for you (used to be a trick one of his grooms enjoyed)... he is huge... and he has a huge noggin'. Evansville Slew gets really wound up if there is a stiff breeze... he'll put on a show which is almost scary.

[ASB]

Well it seems 4 of us have seen him and we all have slightly different measurements for him for the most part... as is the industry, huh?

[Rokeby Forever]

I've been told that Kufwain is a huge sire. I guess for those people who believe, "size does matter," he'd be the pick for them.

They sell unbelievably well, too - something like 7X stud fee on average.

[Rokeby Forever]

Point Given is really only 16.3? I guess his size must have been an optical illusion.

You can't tell me that Point Determined is only 16.3 - he's the biggest sonofagun I can remember racing in the last 10 years!