Pedigree Query

I noticed the work outs are now done. I'm a Bernardini fan, 5 worked. Anyone have any comments on how they looked? Are they similar body types?

http://www.foaltrack.com/BrowseFoalsByS ... ?SireId=19

click 2008 and you will get a good look at many Bernardini 2YO's.

Although I haven't seen him, or vetted him, # 130 has a lot going for him on paper.

He worked an 1/8 in 10 2/5 (just 1 tick off the fastest 1/8 mile breeze time) and he's out of a stakes placed, stakes producing, Storm Cat mare. And his second dam is a Grade I winner and Grade I producer.

He's consigned by Scanlon Training Center.

On paper at least, this is one who in the past could spark quite the bidding duel. Don't know if there's enough people with money these days to have many bidding duels though. I also don't know, if Coolmore is even spending at this sale, if they'd go after a Bernardini given his Maktoum connection. The Maktoum versus Coolmore duels were always the path to insane prices.

He was sold to Nick Zito agent for $140,000 in September so I don't think the Maktoums own part of this one already.

dray33 wrote:http://www.foaltrack.com/BrowseFoalsBySire.aspx?SireId=19

click 2008 and you will get a good look at many Bernardini 2YO's.

Thanks

Hold Your Peace wrote:Although I haven't seen him, or vetted him, # 130 has a lot going for him on paper.

He worked an 1/8 in 10 2/5 (just 1 tick off the fastest 1/8 mile breeze time) and he's out of a stakes placed, stakes producing, Storm Cat mare. And his second dam is a Grade I winner and Grade I producer.

He's consigned by Scanlon Training Center.

On paper at least, this is one who in the past could spark quite the bidding duel. Don't know if there's enough people with money these days to have many bidding duels though. I also don't know, if Coolmore is even spending at this sale, if they'd go after a Bernardini given his Maktoum connection. The Maktoum versus Coolmore duels were always the path to insane prices.

He was sold to Nick Zito agent for $140,000 in September so I don't think the Maktoums own part of this one already.

Considering the stud fee was $100k in 2008, I'm wondering how profitable they will be. I believe Zito's owner will race them if they RNA.

How likely are the Maktoums to buy more than one?

Keep an eye on the Keeneland sale assuming Wilburn (a Bernardini out of a Carson City mare) is entered. He's already worked a half in 48 and change. I have a feeling they're going to look for a big price with him already developing so quickly.

Hold Your Peace wrote:Although I haven't seen him, or vetted him, # 130 has a lot going for him on paper.

He worked an 1/8 in 10 2/5 (just 1 tick off the fastest 1/8 mile breeze time) and he's out of a stakes placed, stakes producing, Storm Cat mare. And his second dam is a Grade I winner and Grade I producer.

He's consigned by Scanlon Training Center.

On paper at least, this is one who in the past could spark quite the bidding duel. Don't know if there's enough people with money these days to have many bidding duels though. I also don't know, if Coolmore is even spending at this sale, if they'd go after a Bernardini given his Maktoum connection. The Maktoum versus Coolmore duels were always the path to insane prices.

He was sold to Nick Zito agent for $140,000 in September so I don't think the Maktoums own part of this one already.

RNA'd for $800,000

Talk about your unrealistic reserves.

I mean you got him for $140,000, at most you've got $200,000 in him and that includes EVERYTHING.

And you won't take something close to $800,000 for him?

If I am not mistaken this horse was bought by Zito for Whitehorse (Rbt Lapenta) so it follows their program. Buy em as yearlings, either sell em as 2 yo's for a lot of money or race em. Da Tara, etc followed same program.

da hossman wrote:If I am not mistaken this horse was bought by Zito for Whitehorse (Rbt Lapenta) so it follows their program. Buy em as yearlings, either sell em as 2 yo's for a lot of money or race em. Da Tara, etc followed same program.

i think war pass, in fact i'm quite sure war pass rna'ed for like 1 million

The sale looks very solid to me.

Thanks to a 2.3M Distorted Humor colt (to Stonestreet) and several dozen other strong prices, both the average and median are currently higher than last year's.

Nice spending by Japanese buyers too.

Hold Your Peace wrote:

Hold Your Peace wrote:Although I haven't seen him, or vetted him, # 130 has a lot going for him on paper.

He worked an 1/8 in 10 2/5 (just 1 tick off the fastest 1/8 mile breeze time) and he's out of a stakes placed, stakes producing, Storm Cat mare. And his second dam is a Grade I winner and Grade I producer.

He's consigned by Scanlon Training Center.

On paper at least, this is one who in the past could spark quite the bidding duel. Don't know if there's enough people with money these days to have many bidding duels though. I also don't know, if Coolmore is even spending at this sale, if they'd go after a Bernardini given his Maktoum connection. The Maktoum versus Coolmore duels were always the path to insane prices.

He was sold to Nick Zito agent for $140,000 in September so I don't think the Maktoums own part of this one already.

RNA'd for $800,000

Talk about your unrealistic reserves.

I mean you got him for $140,000, at most you've got $200,000 in him and that includes EVERYTHING.

And you won't take something close to $800,000 for him?

Well if he's part of the same program to sell the most valuable ones to underwrite their racing program, I can see not letting him go. Why not take the chance on racing him? They don't have a lot to lose and if he steps up and has some legitimate credentials at this time of year in 2011, they could hit a home run.

justinnich wrote:Keep an eye on the Keeneland sale assuming Wilburn (a Bernardini out of a Carson City mare) is entered. He's already worked a half in 48 and change. I have a feeling they're going to look for a big price with him already developing so quickly.

I'm really not familiar with the sales procedure.

Does it make any difference that Wilburn's works make him further ahead when it comes to sales price?

Or is the consignor more important?

Susan, there's certainly no one factor that determines sales price, but since there are 2yo races at 4-5 furlongs starting as early as April, there are probably going to be some buyers interested in stealing some purses early on. Granted, the trauma of the sales process often requires horses to take some time off, so I don't know what kind of shape he'll be in right afterward, but if you have a horse that advanced, you could definitely try to win a few races right away. There are also stakes for 2yo's concurrent with the triple crown period, so an advanced horse can pick up black type before 99% of horses hit the track. I'm just curious how far they'll work the horse in the run-up to the sale since he can obviously go a pretty long way already, but not carrying fractions of 10-11 seconds.

bdw0617 wrote:

da hossman wrote:If I am not mistaken this horse was bought by Zito for Whitehorse (Rbt Lapenta) so it follows their program. Buy em as yearlings, either sell em as 2 yo's for a lot of money or race em. Da Tara, etc followed same program.

i think war pass, in fact i'm quite sure war pass rna'ed for like 1 million

A big number at this sale. How can you tell a newcomer tell if they are all legitimate bids vs someone running them up for other purposes?

Does it help to get the desired price to have a horse go thru and get a high RNA if the horse is entered in another sale or offered privately?

justinnich wrote:Susan, there's certainly no one factor that determines sales price, but since there are 2yo races at 4-5 furlongs starting as early as April, there are probably going to be some buyers interested in stealing some purses early on. Granted, the trauma of the sales process often requires horses to take some time off, so I don't know what kind of shape he'll be in right afterward, but if you have a horse that advanced, you could definitely try to win a few races right away. There are also stakes for 2yo's concurrent with the triple crown period, so an advanced horse can pick up black type before 99% of horses hit the track. I'm just curious how far they'll work the horse in the run-up to the sale since he can obviously go a pretty long way already, but not carrying fractions of 10-11 seconds.

I can certainly understand wanting to get some black type early before most of competition is ready, but it seems such a waste to work them at the 2 yr old sales especially when the important races aren't until late summer/fall.

The CTOB did a study quite a while back comparing race earnings to sales price and work times. The results were not favorable to the buyers or the horses.


At Calder, as often happens, the track was slower earlier in the works so you aren't getting a true comparison of time. Plus, we have some really cheap horses that can run a 20 & change quarter which can't even pay their way.

IMO, I don't really see how working an 1/8 in 10, reflects the quality of a horse, or its future racing. If I were a purchaser, I would prefer to carefully prepare a young horse instead of fighting a shin, or a tender ankle. FMPOV, it seems like those sales prep injuries tend to haunt you.

Per Wilburn, I don't think it's likely he will go in a 2 yr sale, because lots of times if a horse can win 1st out by open lenghts, or with a decent Beyer, agents are calling before you leave the winners circle. To have to back him up to work even a fast 1/4 would mess up his mind too much.