Ears

[Shammy Davis]

Call me nuts, but I was walking along the paddocks the other day looking at the mares and I started to compare the shape of their ears. I've got a young French mare and her ears look like those of a mule. Her sire was an Italian G! winner. I've seen other Euro breedings that have longer and straighter ears. The mares I have from NA breeding are slightly smaller, some have little hooks near the tip, some don't.

I read once that humans have unique ear lobes. I'm wondering if horses have any specific ear characteristics that set them apart from one another.

After discussing this my wife, she has told me to get a life. I'm hoping someone else will take me more seriously.

[Altanbarr]

That heart size xfactor book has a whole chapter on how ear shape can indicate the heart line/size of throroughbreds.

[dray33]

I thought I heard something about "Princequillo ears", a sign that small ears were a good thing.

[Pan Zareta]

I read once that humans have unique ear lobes. I'm wondering if horses have any specific ear characteristics that set them apart from one another.

Now that you mention it....I divide horse ears into three types, the short, curved, 'foxy' ears that used to be called QH ears, but since Marianna published are known as large heart ears, the long straight 'loppy' ears (tho' by no means to do all them 'lop'), and the medium length, slightly curved, comparatively forward-turned, close-set (to the point that the tips are very close together when the animal is alert) Standardbred type ear. It may exist in other breeds, but I've only noticed it in Stdbs. (tho' judging from photos Crimson Satan might have had it).

(Yes, my family and friends think I need to get a life, too.)

That heart size xfactor book has a whole chapter on how ear shape can indicate the heart line/size of throroughbreds.

Chapter 12, Double Copy Mares. The ears were one of several conformational characteristics that the author proposed might be associated with the large heart trait. All of the photo examples used, including Princequillo, had the short curved ears.

[xfactor fan]

Mahmoud had rather short round ears, as did Halo. The Princequillo ear was supposed to be "curly" . Which I've never been able to see in a photo. However ran across a Appaloosa with some TB that had the strangest ears. It looked like someone have taken the ear and given it a half twist to outside. So if the horse was facing forward with ears pricked, the tips with be at right angles to the base of the ear.


Tooks several photos which don't show the twist. So maybe this is what they were talking about.

Anyone else run across curly horse ears?

And the general theory is that the same embryonic tissue that forms the heart also forms the ears, so you can look at the ears and figure out the heart.

[Shammy Davis]

I can't afford the Xfactor book so I'm at a loss on the Ear chapter. My wife has decided that I should look into this more after I told her that our mule ear French mare was sired by PASSING SALE.

http://www.pedigreequery.com/mon+mome

[Shammy Davis]

Altanbarr posted:

That heart size xfactor book has a whole chapter on how ear shape can indicate the heart line/size of throroughbreds.

Just did a search on this book. Found two copies. One is $175 in the US and the other is $260 in Canada.

I use to have a copy but lost it when our house caught fire. The way things look in the old equine book market, I could have funded the majority of my retirement. Now, it looks like I'm going to have depend on Soc. Sec. and an occasional lucky $2 win bet at the track.

It's the same w/Rusmussen & Faversham. BSF was published in 1999 and I saw a copy go for $600 just last week. Well, I'm going to have to depend on those who have copies. Would someone explain the deal about the the general theory that the same embryonic tissue that forms the heart also forms the ears, so you can look at the ears and figure out the heart.

[vallygirl927]

All the horses she bred out of The Last Red never went on to do anything. Whats up with that?

[xfactor fan]

I'll give the ear/heart thing a try.


Think of the process of turning a round blob of cells into a foal. At some point the mass of cells start to differentiate a sphere turns into a tube, so now there is a inside and a outside. The inside becomes the gut, the outside becomes the outside of the foal.

As this process becomes more complex groups of cells start forming more complex organs. At some point a group of cells start to form into a heart. A part of the proto heart cells break off and migrate up to the head area and become ears.

An example of the cell migration is zebra stripes. The stripe on command puts rings around the embryo--like the stripes around a caterpillar. As the tissue changes and migrates the stripes elongate stretch out and migrate. The stripes on the hind quarters move from vertical to horizontal.

Let me do some searching and see if I can turn up a better description of the process.

You have a pm.

[Shammy Davis]

I think I understand. Apparently, though, there are characteristic ears in horses (maybe 3 or 4 types) and not individual specific like I read about humans.

[Pan Zareta]

The Princequillo ear was supposed to be "curly" . Which I've never been able to see in a photo.

Look at the back line of PQ's ears (more accurately, pinna) in conformation shots. Imho, there's a pronounced curve, or curl, to them. Actually, Haun uses neither term in Chapt. 12, but does make note several times of "unusually small ears", apparently referring to the length from the middle of the base to the tip of the pinna. (Imperatrice is mentioned in this chapter only in a pedigree chart. She had nice, long ears that tended to flop - but they didn't slow her down any. )

All the horses she bred out of The Last Red never went on to do anything. Whats up with that?

There are no guarantees. If a large heart was all it took to find the winners' circle, breeding would be much, much easier.

[xfactor fan]

I'm pretty sure the "curly" ears description came from Penny Chenery. Describing Secretariat as having Princequillo's curly ears.

If this is a marker for the large heart, then according to Haun, Kitalpha and Kingmambo should have it. Anyone seen either of these guys in person?

Haun gets a lot of press, but it is best to verify everything she claims.

[CountRaja]

Kitalpha has those "curly"ears

[Pan Zareta]

I'm pretty sure the "curly" ears description came from Penny Chenery. Describing Secretariat as having Princequillo's curly ears.

That's what I thought too, but the only comment of hers re. Secretariat's ears that I can locate a source for is the comparison between his and The Last Red's as cited by Haun. From extant photos, Somethingroyal's ears look like a blend of PQ's and Imperatrice's, shorter like his but straight like hers. Secretariat's have a bit more curve, not to the extent of PQ's.

Haun gets a lot of press, but it is best to verify everything she claims.

She makes a good circumstantial case for the presence of one or more genes influencing heart size on the equine X chrom. It would have been great if sequencing the equine genome had turned up some single gene, bi-allelic trait on the X to confirm the circumstantial evidence, but so far that hasn't happened.

[Linda_d]

I'm pretty sure the "curly" ears description came from Penny Chenery. Describing Secretariat as having Princequillo's curly ears.

That's what I thought too, but the only comment of hers re. Secretariat's ears that I can locate a source for is the comparison between his and The Last Red's as cited by Haun. From extant photos, Somethingroyal's ears look like a blend of PQ's and Imperatrice's, shorter like his but straight like hers. Secretariat's have a bit more curve, not to the extent of PQ's.

Haun gets a lot of press, but it is best to verify everything she claims.

She makes a good circumstantial case for the presence of one or more genes influencing heart size on the equine X chrom. It would have been great if sequencing the equine genome had turned up some single gene, bi-allelic trait on the X to confirm the circumstantial evidence, but so far that hasn't happened.

I can't accept the idea that there's a handful of genes that influence heart size on the X chromosome, and that's a major reason why some sires are outstanding BMS. I think it's a whole lot more complicated than that, especially with TBs that can sprint or go long. I don't even pretend to have more than an interest in and very basic knowledge of genetics, but just trying to figure out how/why horses get white markings (see the Color Corner forum) is so complex that Hahn's idea just doesn't work for me. It's just too simplistic.