To Much Buckpasser?

Understanding pedigrees, inbreeding, dosage, etc.

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Jeff
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To Much Buckpasser?

Postby Jeff » Sun Mar 10, 2013 2:50 pm

http://www.pedigreequery.com/index.php? ... lor=000000

Is this to much Buckpasser? What do you think of the sire?

I'm thinking maybe this mare needs more speed and not the distance this horse brings.

http://www.pedigreequery.com/index.php? ... lor=000000

This pedigree looks like it has the necessary speed, I'm undecided between these two stallions.

A son of AP Indy is exciting, but it bothers me that although 3 wins 1 place and 1 show that his other 13 starts he was near to last in those it appears he can route but lacks speed.

The Perfect Mandate stud displayed exhibitions of speed, not as fashionable a pedigree, but he looks like a good choice for racing in California.

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Pan Zareta
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Postby Pan Zareta » Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:51 am

On paper, the Northern Indy cross doesn't yield any more Buckpasser by blood % (18.5%) than in Found Her's 2006 gelding by Highland Gold. It just brings him in through 4 rather than 3 of his progeny.

Found Her made her first start at 3, was on the board in MSWs at 8 and 8.5f, won at 3 going 8f in her sixth start. She has three foals on the ground, two to race. Who's Your Papa (2006, Highland Gold) made his first start at 4, placed 3d at 5.5f his first time out of the gate, won his 2d start at 6f. Unplaced at longer distances. Salsa Cat (2010, Peppered Cat) placed 5th in an 8f MC last month and ran third at 8.5f in same two days ago.

JMO, there's potential here but I see a need for more talent overall, perhaps most especially of the early-maturing variety. Both sires mentioned were blacktype 2yos, Northern Indy at G3, so are potential tho' as yet unproven sources of early maturing talent. Before making a final decision I'd be inclined look around for a stallion with proven ability to 'improve' his mares. Best of luck whatever you decide!

Jeff
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Postby Jeff » Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:39 pm

I'm not sure there is any such thing as to much Buckpasser, but am willing to consider other points of view :D

Using the inbreeding feature on the pedigreequery I can't find another 5x5x4x4 exact linebreeding example, but there are so many hundreds or thousands of horses with linebreeding to Buckpasser that it seems the pedigree database short circuits after the first several hundred examples.

With N Indy being the only son of AP Indy in Nor Cal, he seems a good choice. The mare's 3 year old filly in her second start this past weekend was quite impressive, and with a 2 year old Seattle Slew line colt galloping in training now, it looks like an AP Indy horse would be a wise choice considering he and his sons have been known to nick very well with Fappiano line mares. 4 lines to Buckpasser, at least it will be drop dead good looking :D

stancaris
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buckpasser in the X angle

Postby stancaris » Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:00 pm

Jeff: I am not a breeding expert by no means. I am basically a handicapper that uses breeding angles. It is interesting that you brought up Buckpasser as being a frequent appearing stallion in pedigrees.

My research has shown that having Buckpasser in ones pedigree is often a positive and having him duplicated can also be a good thing sometimes. Notice I use the word sometimes here because I really do not know the overall effect. My research concerns mainly the Derby, Preakness and Belmont where Buckpasser has been positive.

In the Derby last year: The second place finisher, Bodemeister, was inbred to Buckpasser 5X6.

In 2010 Derby winner Super Saver was inbred to Buckpasser 4X5X5.

In 2003 Derby winner Funny Cide had Buckpasser in the X passing position via his broodmare sire Slewacide. Derby place finisher, Empire Maker was inbred to Buckpasser 5X4.

Aptitude the second place Derby horse in 2000 was inbred to Buckpasser 4X3.

Unbridled carried Buckpasser in the X passing position.

Easy Goer, Belmont Stakes winner, carried Buckpasser in the X passing position.

Recent Belmont winners Drosselmeyer and Summer Bird and Rags to Riches carried Buckpasser in the X passing position.

4 of the top 10 broodmare sires for 2013 that appeared in the Bloodhorse magazine March 16th carried Buckpasser in the X. These 4 were Seeking the Gold, AP Indy, Unbridled and Woodman. Some of the other top broodmare sires that carry Buckpasser in the X are Touch Gold, Danehill, Grand Slam, and Miswaki.

Leading Derby candidates Orb, Revolutionary have Buck in the X and some others are--- Mr. Palmer, Hear the Ghost, and Code West.

Buckpasser usually adds stamina to a pedigree..

If you are interested I can send you a list of stallions that carry Buckpasser in the X passing position. Let me know by emailing me at [email protected]

Jeff
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Postby Jeff » Sun Mar 24, 2013 7:22 pm

Thank you Stan, you'v got mail.

Jeff

stancaris
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Jeff

Postby stancaris » Wed Jul 10, 2013 6:10 pm

Jeff: could you send me your email address again. I have a list I would like to send you.