John Sikura of Hill N Dale commentary

[Tappiano]

Do tell which treachery you speak of. Lay out the facts, please.

[da hossman]

I would assume Dublino is referring to Sikura's job managing the first few seasons of both Candy Ride and Medaglia D'Oro before the majority owners moved those stallions. Also, Saarland stood his first year at HnD before moving to Darby Dan, but as he ended up infertile and a flop, it was of no consequence.

Sikura has since tried to take a majority or at least controlling interest in the stallions he stands. Protecting himself from doing the "heavy lifting" and then having the newly successful stallion taken from him. One cannot blame him for that.

It is truly capitalism at work - if your competitor can offer a better deal and not go broke doing it, he will likely take a lot of your business.

However do not expect "breed Secure" to be offered on proven successful stallions.

[Sysonby]

However do not expect "breed Secure" to be offered on proven successful stallions.

It won't be offered on top flight prospects either.

[Tappiano]

I would assume Dublino is referring to Sikura's job managing the first few seasons of both Candy Ride and Medaglia D'Oro before the majority owners moved those stallions. Also, Saarland stood his first year at HnD before moving to Darby Dan, but as he ended up infertile and a flop, it was of no consequence.

Maybe this would be the perfect time to ask the great assumer to go ask John for the details. Who knows he might even give the facts instead of playing the victim....

[Tappiano]

Sikura has since tried to take a majority or at least controlling interest in the stallions he stands. Protecting himself from doing the "heavy lifting" and then having the newly successful stallion taken from him. One cannot blame him for that.

It's great that you admire what he's doing, but you too are making assumptions that he was right and the others were wrong. Do you know for a fact he upheld his end of the contracts?

[Mood Swings]

The deal that they are offering wont attract any decent mares.

Sikura is still smarting from the treachery he had to put up with after making 2 decent stallions.

He has another on his hands now with Midnight Lute.

I think given time 2-3 years people will be saying this Spendthrift deal wasn't all what it was cracked up to be.

I would have to agree. There will be a few mares that are probably decent but overall it will attract low to mid level mares. Why? Because those with good quality mares are going the commercial route or the proven route. Those "types" of stallions are not the ones being offered for Spendthrifts program. Should they become highly commercial or proven I doubt they will be participants any longer.

On another note, after reading through comments on the Paulick Report, JS is vilified for increasing Midnight Lute's stud fee by 33%.. I thought it was worth pointing out the ML is clearly leading all second crop sires in earnings, wins and stakes wins. It was not that long ago that Spendthrift increased Into Mischief's stud fee from an advertised $7500 to $20,000 (an increase of 167%!) when his progeny started to make headlines. My point is that Mr. Hughes is really not all that different from Mr. Sikura but is coming out smelling like a rose.

edited for bad math

[Tappiano]

Sikura is not saint and neither is Hughes. Hughes still has the last laugh when he decides to send his horses off to a regional market, just as the breeders have earned their lifetime breeding right in the horse... or will he refund the money because the horse didn't stay in Ky for a required number of years?

[westover]

[i) Mood Swings you raise some very valid points as does Dublino.. Good on you! [/i]

[da hossman]

Hi Tap - "the great assumer" ok I am laughing, point made, perhaps I should be careful not to use that phrase too much! No I do not know the inside story on either of those Hill n Dale situations, I only know the basics: The hard part of standing a successful stallion is the early years; once the stallion is successful it does not matter where he stands - it is unfortunate that the farm that worked through the tough years is not able to enjoy the fruits of their labors.

The one exception to the "once a stallion is successful it does not matter where he stands" may be Haisfield/Stonewall...Leroidesanimoux would have a full book of quality mares if owned/managed by anyone else.

Regarding the Lifetime Breeding Right deal and Hughes potentially selling the stallion off to a regional market thereby inconveniencing the holders of those LBR's - everyone that I know that has bought into the plan does so hoping for the big horse. If the horse is not successful enough to stay in KY they are not interested in the horse anyway. The play is for the next Distorted Humor, not the next Closing Argument (apologies to Louisiana).

[Fireslam]

Sikura has since tried to take a majority or at least controlling interest in the stallions he stands. Protecting himself from doing the "heavy lifting" and then having the newly successful stallion taken from him. One cannot blame him for that.

It's great that you admire what he's doing, but you too are making assumptions that he was right and the others were wrong. Do you know for a fact he upheld his end of the contracts?

Seems like you are making those same assumptions.

[Tappiano]

No, I am probably the only person on the board who knows for a fact what went on or at least the only one who stood up to say they are both wrong.

[dublino]

Well then fountain of knowledge enlighten us to what went on?

[Tappiano]

You've got to be kidding me . You come on here and cast aspersions and when you are called out on it you can't even admit you were wrong? If you think in any way, shape or form I'd disclose anything to you then I've got a bridge for sale for you. It looks lovely when I look out the window from my house.

[Tappiano]

I asked you for proof, you have failed to provide it. You can be an advocate for anyone you want but don't make statements as fact when you lack the proof to do so. Asking me to prove you are wrong is easy because you don't have one bit of evidence to support your position.

[dublino]

Edited by moderator