Open Mares
Moderators: Roguelet, WaveMaster, madelyn, Diane
Open Mares
Is there been any studies or qualified opinions on mares having foals after an open year. I've heard of a few good breeders who have done this and say the foal will be more sturdy and powerful, therefore giving a higher chance for earnings and possibly SW????
I'm sure it's been studied by the reproductive research centers, but I don't know any results.
What makes sense to me is that carrying and then nursing a foal is a major stress on the mare's nutrition, and some mares are more prone to have an open season after their first foal. I've had two of my mares that followed their first delivery with a slipped foal.
Also if the mare is very young (still maturing), she needs a lot of nutrition just for her own development, let alone for a growing foal.
A series of yearly deliveries can exhaust a mare's reserves, and cause her not to carry a pregnancy to term, while she replenishes herself.
But an older mare that is open is apparently harder to get in foal again. Others can weigh in on that problem, since I have no personal experience with older mares.
In most cases of healthy fully mature mares with adequate nutrition and supplements, they are designed to carry foals year after year without a break. She often provides her own break year through abortion, slippage, or failure to settle.
We can usually just choose to skip a year if the latest foal is very late in the season or if the mare has foaling complications.
What makes sense to me is that carrying and then nursing a foal is a major stress on the mare's nutrition, and some mares are more prone to have an open season after their first foal. I've had two of my mares that followed their first delivery with a slipped foal.
Also if the mare is very young (still maturing), she needs a lot of nutrition just for her own development, let alone for a growing foal.
A series of yearly deliveries can exhaust a mare's reserves, and cause her not to carry a pregnancy to term, while she replenishes herself.
But an older mare that is open is apparently harder to get in foal again. Others can weigh in on that problem, since I have no personal experience with older mares.
In most cases of healthy fully mature mares with adequate nutrition and supplements, they are designed to carry foals year after year without a break. She often provides her own break year through abortion, slippage, or failure to settle.
We can usually just choose to skip a year if the latest foal is very late in the season or if the mare has foaling complications.
Rocking H
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luvthegame
- Suckling
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- Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2007 8:28 pm
I have some mares in my band that are really breed every other year mares. They give so much to the foal on the ground that I do not believe they would produce another great individual while they are nursing. Mine is not a factory approach.. of course I don't have the same expenses as someone who boards their mares.
So Run for the Roses, as fast as you can.....
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Mood Swings
- Grade II Winner
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- Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2006 6:23 am
- Location: Ontario, Canada
I find this to be a fascinating topic. I know there are a lot of breeders who believe in breeding their mares only every other year in order to have "stronger" foals and hopefully stronger/better race horses. There are some mares that can produce stand- out foals year after year while there are others that need a year off here and there in order to replenish their nutrient stores. I have always enjoyed reading through the stakes results in the blood horse and noting whether the stakes horse was born after it's dam had a barren year or aborted. There are a lot born after a barren or not bred year.
I have a mare that I would love to get a foal out of every year but so far she has had three foals and aborted a foal in between each of them. She has had to be covered twice so far this year and I am thinking if she is not in foal on Monday she will get the year off (if the stallion owner will let me
- darn contracts ) Maybe she is trying to tell me something 
I have a mare that I would love to get a foal out of every year but so far she has had three foals and aborted a foal in between each of them. She has had to be covered twice so far this year and I am thinking if she is not in foal on Monday she will get the year off (if the stallion owner will let me
- darn contracts ) Maybe she is trying to tell me something "People come and go but horses leave hoofprints on your heart"
Hi Folks,
This is a current topic on another forum begun by someone who has presented some (I believe incomplete) data to support the notion that foals after an open year (or two) are better performers.
I believe that any mare that is able and willing should be bred in every year possible, whether they have a foal or not. My empirical observation is that good breeding mares that are intentionally not bred often begin to have problems getting in foal. When a mare becomes incapable of having foals year after year they simply won't have a foal. I don't like 'fooling' with Mother Nature.
It's important to remember that, as a breed, only 60% of the mares bred in any given year will have live foals. This number increases in the best breeding areas like Kentucky or by the quality of the mare or stallion because owners are willing to accept the cost of therapies like regumate. Highly fertile stallions like Distorted Humor are getting @80% live foals even from a large book and I'd shell out the cash to do as much as I could to protect my investment if I were breeding to him or using a valuable mare.
There’s a theory that mares will have their best foals in their first five and at least there's some scientific basis for this idea. We know that women that have children later in life are usually at higher risk for birth defect or problems. There are several reasons for this including less ability to handle the stress of pregnancy as well as the fact that females are born with a quotient of eggs and it's possible that they may 'degrade' over time.
Most foals will be born as either first foals or after 1 or 2 foals in a row. Age is a factor but there’s a decrease every year in the number of mares that are having consecutive foals. Mares like Extra Alarm, (17 consecutive foals) are rare as hens’ teeth. I’d look to the family breeding history for some guidance in what to expect. Lilies Cook’N had her first foal in late April 1996 and her 8th consecutive on January 5th, 2003 (moved up every year). She’s certainly an exception. I’ve listed the produce of the exceptional mare, Battle Creek Girl, below:
She had 20 foals in all (wow) and fifteen consecutive. Her first four (all consecutive) are weak, her first black-type is her 5th (imagine if you sold her then!?) her 6th (Tricky Creek), 7th, 9th, 13th and 15th consecutive foals are all stakes winners. Parade Ground (1997) is a SW foal after an open year. She lends a little support but mainly contradicts these theories.
I don't know of any study that's addressed either of these points, foals after open years or first five foals, and I've found many instances (not quite as eye-popping asBattle Creek Girl) to support or contradict these ideas.
Regards,
Pete
This is a current topic on another forum begun by someone who has presented some (I believe incomplete) data to support the notion that foals after an open year (or two) are better performers.
I believe that any mare that is able and willing should be bred in every year possible, whether they have a foal or not. My empirical observation is that good breeding mares that are intentionally not bred often begin to have problems getting in foal. When a mare becomes incapable of having foals year after year they simply won't have a foal. I don't like 'fooling' with Mother Nature.
It's important to remember that, as a breed, only 60% of the mares bred in any given year will have live foals. This number increases in the best breeding areas like Kentucky or by the quality of the mare or stallion because owners are willing to accept the cost of therapies like regumate. Highly fertile stallions like Distorted Humor are getting @80% live foals even from a large book and I'd shell out the cash to do as much as I could to protect my investment if I were breeding to him or using a valuable mare.
There’s a theory that mares will have their best foals in their first five and at least there's some scientific basis for this idea. We know that women that have children later in life are usually at higher risk for birth defect or problems. There are several reasons for this including less ability to handle the stress of pregnancy as well as the fact that females are born with a quotient of eggs and it's possible that they may 'degrade' over time.
Most foals will be born as either first foals or after 1 or 2 foals in a row. Age is a factor but there’s a decrease every year in the number of mares that are having consecutive foals. Mares like Extra Alarm, (17 consecutive foals) are rare as hens’ teeth. I’d look to the family breeding history for some guidance in what to expect. Lilies Cook’N had her first foal in late April 1996 and her 8th consecutive on January 5th, 2003 (moved up every year). She’s certainly an exception. I’ve listed the produce of the exceptional mare, Battle Creek Girl, below:
- 1981 Full Retreat,(f.Full Out). 11-2-2-1,$18,905.
1982 Will To,(f.Ack Ack). 8-M-0-0,$0.
1983 Majestic Luck,(f.What Luck). 4-M-2-2,$5,060.
1984 Beribboned,(f.Well Decorated). 14-1-2-2,$10,860.
1985 Matriarch,(f.Wavering Monarch). 39-7-4-6,$107,185..3rd Ocean City S.
1986 TRICKY CREEK,(c.Clever Trick). 37-9-6-8,$873,288..G2 winner at 2,3,4.
1987 WAVERING GIRL,(f.Wavering Monarch). 22-6-3-3,$314,084..Natalma S -L.
1988 The Gifted One,(c.Time For A Change). 6-1-1-0,$12,815.
1989 SPEED DIALER,(f.Phone Trick). 18-5-5-3,$384,601..G2 winner at 2.
1990 Defense Spending,(f.Spend A Buck). 10-2-2-1,$ 50,797.
1991 Chrys,(c.Forty Niner). 94-10-14-15,$231,323.
1992 Swiss Asset,(c.Private Account). 80-14-15-16,$331,022..2nd Skipper Bill S -R.
1993 EVERHOPE,(f.Danzig). 24-6-6-2,$310,233..Edgewood S -L.
1994 Battle Hymn,(f.Danzig). 10-2-1-3,$56,582.
1995 PARADE GROUND,(c.Kingmambo). 21-7-6-4,$794,995..G2, 4xG3 winner.
1996 Barren
1997 PARADE LEADER,(c.Kingmambo). 30-7-4-5,$712,507..New Orleans H -G2.
1999 King's Consul,(c.Kingmambo). 1-1-0-0,$24,600.
2000 New Harmony,(f.A.P. Indy). Unraced
2001 Unnamed,(c.Belong To Me).
She had 20 foals in all (wow) and fifteen consecutive. Her first four (all consecutive) are weak, her first black-type is her 5th (imagine if you sold her then!?) her 6th (Tricky Creek), 7th, 9th, 13th and 15th consecutive foals are all stakes winners. Parade Ground (1997) is a SW foal after an open year. She lends a little support but mainly contradicts these theories.
I don't know of any study that's addressed either of these points, foals after open years or first five foals, and I've found many instances (not quite as eye-popping asBattle Creek Girl) to support or contradict these ideas.
Regards,
Pete
Has a palomino jean that pop up some.
This stallion is DNA ... all foal can be MBNA inrolled.
Horses like their credit cards. - Four Forty Farms
This stallion is DNA ... all foal can be MBNA inrolled.
Horses like their credit cards. - Four Forty Farms
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Rokeby Forever
- Darley line
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- Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 4:52 pm
- Location: Reno, NV
Hi Pete,
Wow! That's quite an example you dug up!
Could you imagine being Belong To Me? He must have asked himself, "This mare has had 19 foals...why me?" LOL!
Wow! That's quite an example you dug up!
Could you imagine being Belong To Me? He must have asked himself, "This mare has had 19 foals...why me?" LOL!
What synthetics are to California racing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU
Hi Rokeby,
I missed two years!
Battle Creek Girl ct'd:
2002 Barren
2003 Union Creek, (f. Dixie Union) unplaced in 4 starts at 2 and 3. $4,645
Belong To Me missed with a great mare so he can think what he wants.
Regards,
Pete
I missed two years!
Battle Creek Girl ct'd:
2002 Barren
2003 Union Creek, (f. Dixie Union) unplaced in 4 starts at 2 and 3. $4,645
Belong To Me missed with a great mare so he can think what he wants.
Regards,
Pete
Has a palomino jean that pop up some.
This stallion is DNA ... all foal can be MBNA inrolled.
Horses like their credit cards. - Four Forty Farms
This stallion is DNA ... all foal can be MBNA inrolled.
Horses like their credit cards. - Four Forty Farms
