I appreciate that, and I thank you. Apology accepted. My point is merely to not mention track names. I am not arguing your point of KK racing in the northwest rather than the triple crown circuit. I simply do not like the derogatory presumtive name calling of PM. No, it's not the best track out there, but dang it, it's our's, and we race there. We race in California, and Canada, as well as Washington. In other words, we race up and down the west coast. I just don't appreciate certain tracks being called out is all.
And, by the way, I have no idea how KK made it this far, but that's another story....
2013 Preakness Field
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bdw0617
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on another note,
today was qutie possiboy the most boring undercard in the history of the triple crown. and If I am exaggerating it's not by much
Here's my thing. I'm all for expanded horse racing coverage. but you do a diservice to the game by showing bad races or races that no one wants to watch.
today i would have been 100% cool with them dropping the NBC sports coverage. there was nothing of note whatsoever in the entire 3 hours of coverage. I mean yeah summer applause won the Gallorate I know who summer applause is but i mean, this is what I do lol.
pimlico IMHO needs to compact black eyed susan day and Preakness day they don't have enough for 2 days. you put
the turf sprint
dirt sprint
pimlico special
black eyed susan
dixie
Preakness
on one card than that's a good card
today i actually saw a horse go off at even money.. in a stakes race no less, that i had no idea who the horse was.. the repole horse notadogbutalamlla.. no clue. for me not to have even heard of a stakes horse that runs on a big day that's pretty bad.
today was qutie possiboy the most boring undercard in the history of the triple crown. and If I am exaggerating it's not by much
Here's my thing. I'm all for expanded horse racing coverage. but you do a diservice to the game by showing bad races or races that no one wants to watch.
today i would have been 100% cool with them dropping the NBC sports coverage. there was nothing of note whatsoever in the entire 3 hours of coverage. I mean yeah summer applause won the Gallorate I know who summer applause is but i mean, this is what I do lol.
pimlico IMHO needs to compact black eyed susan day and Preakness day they don't have enough for 2 days. you put
the turf sprint
dirt sprint
pimlico special
black eyed susan
dixie
Preakness
on one card than that's a good card
today i actually saw a horse go off at even money.. in a stakes race no less, that i had no idea who the horse was.. the repole horse notadogbutalamlla.. no clue. for me not to have even heard of a stakes horse that runs on a big day that's pretty bad.
"When the solution is simple, God is answering.”
- Einstein
- Einstein
Not to add fuel to any fire but name the Grade 1 races Portland Meadows stages compared to Santa Anita or Gulfstream or Churchill Downs.
If Portland downs is a small track with small time horses there is nothing wrong with stating that.
If you enjoy going racing there who cares, your money your choice up to you.
But don't be offended by the truth.
If Portland downs is a small track with small time horses there is nothing wrong with stating that.
If you enjoy going racing there who cares, your money your choice up to you.
But don't be offended by the truth.
Edited by Moderator
hi bdw016
Reality is...Orb did NOT get stuck in traffic, and (in the Preakness) was clearly NOT what most pundits, prognosticators and media expected him to be. Yes, he won the Florida Derby-G1, but consider this, he won that race in 1:50.87...the slowest Florida Derby since Friends Lake (1:51.38 ) in 2004.
As for Preakness winner Oxbow, he won the Lecomte-G3 in 1:43.30...the second slowest time since the race has been run at a mile and a sixteenth; the slowest time was run last year (2012) in 1:43.49 (by winner Wilkinson). As for the fastest winning time, it was 1:40.09 (Ron The Greek, in 2009)...3 seconds plus faster than Oxbow in 2013. You tell me, isn't 3 seconds plus considered by many (if not most) to be a 15 length spread? Hmmm...and maybe Oxbow wasn't as much in love with the sealed surface on KyDerby day, as was Orb. Just sayin'
.
And what about Verrazano's Wood? Including 1991 thru 2013 (that's 23 years), all but 3 Wood winners got to the wire in time faster than Verrazano (1:50.27); from '91 thru 2013, the only 3 Wood Memorial winners that ran a slower winning time than Verrazano are Tale of Ekati (1:52.35), Bob and John (1:51.54), and Gemologist (1:50.96). Just sayin' . For further reference, ALL of the other 19 Wood Memorial winning times from 1991 to current, were run in 1:47 and change, 1:48 and change, or 1:49 and change; the fastest being Bellamy Road in 2005 (147.16). Is it unreasonable to describe Verrazano's Wood as slow, or is not very fast maybe a better choice of words?
For some perspective, since 1995 the only slower KyDerby winning times than Orb (2:02.89), were Super Saver in 2010 (2:04.45), Smarty Jones in 2004 (2:04.06); and Charismatic in 1999 (2:03.20). All others were faster, including the sometimes maligned Giacomo (2:02.75), Mine that Bird (2:02.66), and Monarchos (1:59.97). Hmmm . Comes down to this...Orb's KyDerby was run in what might be described as a rather pedestrian 2:02.89, despite brilliant fractions over a sealed track that certainly benefitted some (including Orb).
When you went on record and declared (as you did)..."the only way orb loses this race (the Preakness) is if he gets stuck in traffic", an initial thought of mine was...you need to have an ownership interest in a racehorse, and experience the unique brand of reality that is thoroughbred horseracing.
And by the way...this year's Preakness win by Oxbow (1:57.54) was the slowest since 1961 when Carry Back won it in 1:57.60.
Just askin' , how good really (at least based on what we've seen thus far) is this year's group of 3-yo colts/geldings?
Lookin' forward to hearing your thought re the Belmomt
.
Best to ya.
Respectfully
bdw0617 wrote:... the only way orb loses this race (the Preakness) is if he gets stuck in traffic
Reality is...Orb did NOT get stuck in traffic, and (in the Preakness) was clearly NOT what most pundits, prognosticators and media expected him to be. Yes, he won the Florida Derby-G1, but consider this, he won that race in 1:50.87...the slowest Florida Derby since Friends Lake (1:51.38 ) in 2004.
As for Preakness winner Oxbow, he won the Lecomte-G3 in 1:43.30...the second slowest time since the race has been run at a mile and a sixteenth; the slowest time was run last year (2012) in 1:43.49 (by winner Wilkinson). As for the fastest winning time, it was 1:40.09 (Ron The Greek, in 2009)...3 seconds plus faster than Oxbow in 2013. You tell me, isn't 3 seconds plus considered by many (if not most) to be a 15 length spread? Hmmm...and maybe Oxbow wasn't as much in love with the sealed surface on KyDerby day, as was Orb. Just sayin'
.
And what about Verrazano's Wood? Including 1991 thru 2013 (that's 23 years), all but 3 Wood winners got to the wire in time faster than Verrazano (1:50.27); from '91 thru 2013, the only 3 Wood Memorial winners that ran a slower winning time than Verrazano are Tale of Ekati (1:52.35), Bob and John (1:51.54), and Gemologist (1:50.96). Just sayin'
. For further reference, ALL of the other 19 Wood Memorial winning times from 1991 to current, were run in 1:47 and change, 1:48 and change, or 1:49 and change; the fastest being Bellamy Road in 2005 (147.16). Is it unreasonable to describe Verrazano's Wood as slow, or is not very fast maybe a better choice of words?
For some perspective, since 1995 the only slower KyDerby winning times than Orb (2:02.89), were Super Saver in 2010 (2:04.45), Smarty Jones in 2004 (2:04.06); and Charismatic in 1999 (2:03.20). All others were faster, including the sometimes maligned Giacomo (2:02.75), Mine that Bird (2:02.66), and Monarchos (1:59.97). Hmmm
. Comes down to this...Orb's KyDerby was run in what might be described as a rather pedestrian 2:02.89, despite brilliant fractions over a sealed track that certainly benefitted some (including Orb).
When you went on record and declared (as you did)..."the only way orb loses this race (the Preakness) is if he gets stuck in traffic", an initial thought of mine was...you need to have an ownership interest in a racehorse, and experience the unique brand of reality that is thoroughbred horseracing.
And by the way...this year's Preakness win by Oxbow (1:57.54) was the slowest since 1961 when Carry Back won it in 1:57.60.
Just askin'
, how good really (at least based on what we've seen thus far) is this year's group of 3-yo colts/geldings?
Lookin' forward to hearing your thought re the Belmomt
.
Best to ya.
Respectfully
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bdw0617
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i think the mistake people are going to make is think this race means something and in the grand scheme of things it doesn't.
orb never had a chance. with this pace and with being trapped and i dont' think he cared for the surface either. but when they hit the half mile pole in 48 and change the race was over pimlico is not a track where you can let a good horse shake lose on the lead with a soft pace and go and get him
an d don't get me started on Kevin Krigger. he might have single handily cost the triple crown with his ****ty ride on goldencents. he was the speed. he was the second more important horse int he race and he blew it.
if you pay attention to the race as it unfolds, the only real change in positions was goldencents dropping out. Oxbow lead the entire step, itsmylukcyday was right there the entire race. that tells me it was more of a funky ran race than a real talent determining race
If orb runs in the belmont, and because of who the connections are I think it's about a 50% chance, he runs away and hides. he's BETTER than these horses. I saw absoutly nothing that made me think he isn't the best horse in the country still. I dont' think he's curlin or even I'll have another. but i think if he gets clean run with a solid pace he's better than any 3YO in this crop and that's all that matters.
orb never had a chance. with this pace and with being trapped and i dont' think he cared for the surface either. but when they hit the half mile pole in 48 and change the race was over pimlico is not a track where you can let a good horse shake lose on the lead with a soft pace and go and get him
an d don't get me started on Kevin Krigger. he might have single handily cost the triple crown with his ****ty ride on goldencents. he was the speed. he was the second more important horse int he race and he blew it.
if you pay attention to the race as it unfolds, the only real change in positions was goldencents dropping out. Oxbow lead the entire step, itsmylukcyday was right there the entire race. that tells me it was more of a funky ran race than a real talent determining race
If orb runs in the belmont, and because of who the connections are I think it's about a 50% chance, he runs away and hides. he's BETTER than these horses. I saw absoutly nothing that made me think he isn't the best horse in the country still. I dont' think he's curlin or even I'll have another. but i think if he gets clean run with a solid pace he's better than any 3YO in this crop and that's all that matters.
"When the solution is simple, God is answering.”
- Einstein
- Einstein
You yanks need to stop focusing on time and start focusing on the finishing line, thats all that matters.
Ever think the Derby and the Preakness was probably the cleanest in 50 years?
Steroids were banned just before these colts hit the race track.
And look at the pedigrees that are shining through.
And a trainer like Shug winning a Derby - coincidence?
Ever think the Derby and the Preakness was probably the cleanest in 50 years?
Steroids were banned just before these colts hit the race track.
And look at the pedigrees that are shining through.
And a trainer like Shug winning a Derby - coincidence?
Edited by Moderator
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bdw0617
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damn that's a pretty good point
i will say it's funny how we talk about how steriods and drugs are the problem but IMHO it shows why for the most part they will always be around ; americans love speed. we will forgive just about antyhing as long as you can produce brilliance.
Our love of speed allows for cheating to run wild
even with that said I don't think Orb is as good as Street Sense or Curlin but i think he's better than super saver or mine that bird
i will say it's funny how we talk about how steriods and drugs are the problem but IMHO it shows why for the most part they will always be around ; americans love speed. we will forgive just about antyhing as long as you can produce brilliance.
Our love of speed allows for cheating to run wild
even with that said I don't think Orb is as good as Street Sense or Curlin but i think he's better than super saver or mine that bird
"When the solution is simple, God is answering.”
- Einstein
- Einstein
bdw0617 wrote:big brown is actually a pretty good sire (so far)
very few horses reproduce themselves it doesn't mean all of them are on drugs that's a logical fallacy
Big brown has had 53 runners for 26 winners and 2 stakes winners no graded stakes winners.
His AEI is 1.46 compared to 2.10
So he is dragging his mares down by 30%.
His numbers need to drastically improve or its Korea for him.
Edited by Moderator