Hansel back in US

Cree · Postby **Cree** » Wed Feb 08, 2006 5:37 pm

Greatest news I've heard all week. Loved him when he ran, and I was sad, so very sad to see him go.
http://breeding.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=32113

Heidilady · Postby **Heidilady** » Wed Feb 08, 2006 11:34 pm

Yay! Now if only we can get Strike the Gold back it'll complete that year's classic winners. The Turks won't let go even though he's hardly Storm Cat. They know Old Friends wants him really bad and are being stubborn apparently, esp. on any talk of a price tag. They're trying to retire him, not start up a top stud farm ya turds. He ain't worth millions anymore...not to them anyway.

I wonder if Hansel can try for a crop or something..small...just so we get one last US group albeit a tiny one.

summerhorse · Postby **summerhorse** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 8:16 am

I'm sure if he's willing the farm would probably oblige a nice mare...

madelyn · Postby **madelyn** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 8:38 am

Boy have I got a mare for him.....Oh well. Virginia... Too far and not KY eligible...

austique · Postby **austique** » Fri Feb 10, 2006 12:06 pm

I think Hansel has proven he doesn't have a whole lot to add to the genetic equation. I just wish him a happy retirement.

Heidilady · Postby **Heidilady** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 2:42 pm

I was poking around the 2010 mares bred list and saw Hansel bred 1 mare last year. Is he pensioned? Low fertility? Low demand? I assume he's still with us.

Patuxet · Postby **Patuxet** » Sun Apr 24, 2011 10:59 am

Heidilady:

What precise information can you share with us about how attempts by Old Friends to negotiate the transfer of Strike The Gold have been rebuffed by the Jockey Club of Turkey? And do you know if Old Friends has also tried and had a similar lack of success negotiating the repatriation of KY Derby winner Sea Here with them?

Of the two Sea Hero appears to be the less successful/popular. In 2011 he's standing for a stud fee that is the Turkish equivalent of $1300 while Strike The Gold stands for approximately $3300. By comparison Powerscourt stands for around $4000 and Victory Gallop for $5000.

Referring to the Jockey Club of Turkey as you did as "turds" strikes me as unnecessarily rude. I trust Old Friends chooses to use more diplomatic language..

Crystal · Postby **Crystal** » Sun Apr 24, 2011 11:43 am

I dont think OF is in the position financially to negotiate the return of any horse to the US. I can only assume the sale contract of the former stallions' owners may have have a clause of return.. Or perhaps the current standing farm that no longer has use for them will in fact contact their former connections about a return (even if it is not in contract form). I only say this because I dont know of many pensioned stallions in former countries.. I'm sure there are some that are contently living out their days, but.. with returning to the US to the former farm there could be a donation of the stallion to Old Friends. But I know of a lot of farms that are just happy to get them back and let them just hang out at the farm, either being a paddock ornament or teaser.

Shammy Davis · Postby **Shammy Davis** » Sun Apr 24, 2011 6:33 pm

It's so important to keep track of the racehorses we send overseas.

http://www.whitehorseproductions.com/database1.html

Jorge · Postby **Jorge** » Sun Apr 24, 2011 8:06 pm

I have a question. What is the procedure if the new owners want to get at least one last product sired by him or any other retired horse? Is there any limitation?

Article found at:

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/ ... in-america

Heidilady · Postby **Heidilady** » Sun Apr 24, 2011 11:40 pm

Patuxet wrote:Heidilady:

What precise information can you share with us about how attempts by Old Friends to negotiate the transfer of Strike The Gold have been rebuffed by the Jockey Club of Turkey? And do you know if Old Friends has also tried and had a similar lack of success negotiating the repatriation of KY Derby winner Sea Here with them?

Your post threw me for a second. Sorry, but this thread was from 5 years ago. Restarting it was perhaps unwise, however, I knew there'd been a Hansel thread on this board, and I was reluctant to start a new one. I didn't realize the date, or I would have. Wow. Has it been that long?

When you ask for precise information, there's actually so much that I've read and/or heard from Blowen interviews that I really can't give you a catalogued list. I've been following it for years. Here's one article from Bloodhorse (from the article's date, it was just days before the story broke on Ferdinand's slaughter): http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/ ... d-sea-hero Blowen does podcasts from time to time. I almost got one of the $50 certificates to help return Strike the Gold, but they'd stopped selling them. I'm guessing that was because the TJC wouldn't turn him over for any amount within range. The more the story goes on, the more it becomes clear that the TJC is asking for a lot because they figured if Old Friends is desperate enough, the sky's the limit. (I've seen trainers do that when someone tries to buy a horse before it runs in a bottom feeding claimer and breaks down--they ask for a ton because hey, the bleeding heart will pay anything right? Then the horse breaks down in the race or gets hurt and can't be ridden soundly again.) Try "At the Races with Steve Byk" online. There should be a way to search for Michael's name, but it isn't as easy to figure out the subject matter without going podcast by podcast. He's been on a lot. Bloodhorse did a Talkin' Horses segment with him. I don't remember if he mentioned STG there, but it's possible. I really do apologize, but it's available online and going back over it will not only take time, it'll make me mad again. STG was the first Derby I saw on tv and my first Derby winner pick. I'm kind of attached.

Yes they have tried to get Sea Hero. Obviously they've been unsuccessful, however I don't know if the TJC has tried to charge as much for him. Maybe he's more get-able. They're in effect price gauging these stallions.

Even if you argue they were worth more 8 years ago when all this started in earnest, these are aging stallions at this point. If they don't let them go now, they will simply die of old age if they're lucky. Speaking of which...in the article I showed you, Zito says he asked what they do with horses who've outlived their usefulness. He was told "we eat them." I have no doubt they do. We're looking at a Ferdinand situation here if we're not careful, although in his case he was likely used for dog food in Japan.

Patuxet wrote:Of the two Sea Hero appears to be the less successful/popular. In 2011 he's standing for a stud fee that is the Turkish equivalent of $1300 while Strike The Gold stands for approximately $3300. By comparison Powerscourt stands for around $4000 and Victory Gallop for $5000.

STG was a son of Alydar so I wonder if that makes the difference. I found some thing on Wikipedia (a site that's always true, as I'm sure you know) that maybe STG got a nice sprinter a decade ago. It could've gotten him more name recognition and a higher fee. It's sad that Sea Hero's trainer Mack Miller died this past December. He won't get to see his charge again. As an old man, I'm sure he didn't make a habit of flying to Turkey to see one horse so he probably hadn't seen him in years.

I do wonder if OF could get someone to go in there and pretend to want him in Germany or something to keep the TJC from realizing how much they can try to squeeze from Old Friends. They're trading off the desperation of people like Michael and Zito to make sure these horses are safe. It's not even an effort to sell working stallions for what they're worth as stallions.

Patuxet wrote:Referring to the Jockey Club of Turkey as you did as "turds" strikes me as unnecessarily rude. I trust Old Friends chooses to use more diplomatic language..

It might've been rude, but I argue "unnecessarily" is not really applicable here. They're abusing a good man's desire to bring these horses home. [If you take note of the current Old Friends financial situation, he needs all the help he can get due to a bank snafu. If you know anybody who can contribute, urge them to. He's one of the finest men in our sport.] The TJC was charging what they thought they could get away with 8 years ago when Blowen first got Zito and Bill Farish (then US Ambassador to Great Britain) to help talk to them. The TJC goes 'hey these guys really want these stallions, let's squeeze as much money as possible from them because they'll probably pay anything.' I'm sure one could argue they don't have to do something nice and retire him--sure they don't, but jacking up a charity for money? Really? They're free to say "no thank you, we do not wish to retire him at this time." A pensioned stallion isn't worth the same as a working one, and a horse bought by donations won't be worth millions to that charity. Alysheba was retired with kindness by King Abdullah, and I want to say that the king sponsored his upkeep at the KY Horse Park. It'd be great if more owners were like that.

I know Nick Zito's active in this sort of thing, and I'm sure Michael Blowen still keeps up with the Turkey-based US-bred stallions. I'd love to know if the TJC's position has changed, but if it's still 'how bad do you want him?' then they're screwed. STG is our oldest living Derby winner, and Sea Hero might be before too long. It'd be nice if they could come home.

Patuxet · Postby **Patuxet** » Mon Apr 25, 2011 3:20 am

Thank you for the update and link. I hadn't noticed the original date of the thread.

Strike The Gold appears to have been one of the more popular TJC stallions, until recently standing for one of its higher stud fees.

Allison

Jorge · Postby **Jorge** » Tue Apr 26, 2011 8:58 am

Two ideas:

01. Why not establish and sponsor the "Old Friends" at another
nearby country where the cost of operation is much lower.

02. Why not analize the posibility of establishing an insurace fund to pay for the safe return of any Triple Crown race winner who ends up in another country under certain strict parameters and responsibilities?