WERK %

[griff]

A friend has a mare that produces a WERK A++ 2075% when paired with Dance With Ravens. [Dance With Ravens X Dream Fever]

Another WERK mating she has found [Emancipator X Adamandia's Girl] produces an A++ 207%

Logic tell me that a WERK A++ 2075% is better than a WERK A++ 207% but I'd like to know more about this % and how it's calculated.

griff

[Sam]

Call.

THE.

COMPANY.

510/490-1111

You wouldn't call Chevrolet to ask advice on your Pontiac, would you?

Someone PLEASE explain to me why people insist asking for second/third/fourth hand (and often biased) interpretations rather than take 10 minutes out of their lives to get the REAL answer from the people who ACTUALLY OWN THE SYSTEM.

Seriously, this is getting old. Especially since anyone whose been here more than a month KNOWS the only things that come from starting any thread with nicks/werks in the title is more hate spewing from Michael. I'm beginning to think people are asking JUST to start shit.

I'm at the point where I think Rogue needs to put a sticky the top of all the forums banning discussing nicks/werk at all.

eta

Griff, none of that is really directed at you. My frustration comes more from the fact that I HATE this topic coming up at all anymore because nothing good EVER comes from any of these threads.

[griff]

sam

It may not have beeen directed at me;however, it sure feels like it was directed at me.

I suspect answers to a vast majority of the questions posted on this site could be researched and found on other sites or in other availabe publications.

If you do not wish to participate in this discussion it's fine with me but I see nothing wrong with my post. After all no one is forcing you to read, consider or respond to anything posted on this site.


griff

PS: I blieve we already have a site manger that determins what is appropriate and not appropriate. are you looking to replace her?

g

[Sam]

It may not have beeen directed at me;however, it sure feels like it was directed at me.

That's why I added the last sentence. Like I said, it wasn't really directed at you so I apologise. This topic JUST came up about 2 weeks ago and it goes like it always does. It has become as old and ridiculous as these idiotic Phalaris threads.

I suspect answers to a vast majority of the questions posted on this site could be researched and found on other sites or in other availabe publications.

This one couldn't. The best and only real way to get the answers you're looking for is to call Werk themselves.

In a nutshell -- No, the percentage is not better because it's higher. As with anything else, people see numbers and get focused. The percentage is an indicator of inbreeding, nothing more. The higher number simply means one hypo foal is more inbred than the other. It's actually a bit more complicated than that, but beyond that, it's been too long since I worked there I've forgotten what most of that stuff represents and how it's calculated.

PS: I blieve we already have a site manger that determins what is appropriate and not appropriate. are you looking to replace her?

noddin'

I over-stepped... she'll smack me for it later.

eta

I thought I remember seeing this... the word from on high as of Feb 2006

http://www.pedigreequery.com/forum/view ... light=werk

[PHAR LAP]

OK I did call the company and they said they will NOT give specific answers to my specific questions over the phone. That I would have to order a report depending on how much research i wanted done.

[Sam]

OK I did call the company and they said they will NOT give specific answers to my specific questions over the phone. That I would have to order a report depending on how much research i wanted done.

Bullshit. Especially since it's 5:30 there and they close around 4 since most of their clients are on the east coast. I always left at 3pm unless we were working special projects.

Edie, go back to your own board and troll.

[PHAR LAP]

I never said exactly when I called. I called earlier this week after this topic came up before. You kept saying to call them so I did.

[Sam]

I never said exactly when I called. I called earlier this week after this topic came up before. You kept saying to call them so I did.

You're still lying since I used to field these calls daily and know damn well they WILL answer them.

[ragsdaj1]

http://www.werkhorse.com/the_werk_nick_ ... ting.shtml

The percentages are a scale from one letter grade to the next. I do not call these folks, but they always answer an email (I've had two) in a couple of days.

JonR

[Sam]

http://www.werkhorse.com/the_werk_nick_rating/what_is_a_werk_nick_rating.shtml

The percentages are a scale from one letter grade to the next. I do not call these folks, but they always answer an email (I've had two) in a couple of days.

JonR

That's new... wonder when they updated the site.

I do know the letter grade can be affected by inbreeding (like breeding a Forty Niner son to a Fappiano daughter) which is why griff has two A++ nicks with percentage grades that say one should be an A according to that chart.

[CA Michael]

More tomorrow (a LOT more), having just got home from a long trip.

But the short answer is that the SAMPLING size Werk uses is so small, the difference between the first and second percentages Griff offered may be as small as ONE HORSE, perhaps as insignificant as the winner of the Assiniboia Mile Stakes.

The small number of samples Werk utilizes in formulating his so-called Nick Rating System is only one of the many FACTS which render it statistically useless as an interpretive tool...notwithstanding the jaded opinions of Werk, his employees, and former employees.

[PHAR LAP]

Werk analysis totally disregards female famlies, there goes 50% right there.

[ragsdaj1]

Werk analysis totally disregards female famlies, there goes 50% right there.

quote from werk: "It must be stressed that a below “Average” Werk Nick Rating® does not guarantee or even predict failure. It means only that, to date, the particular sire-line cross has fallen at least 16% short of what would be expected. Nicks can and do change over time.

Consequently, an above Average Nick Rating must be kept in proper perspective as there are other factors that must be considered when arranging a mating or selecting a horse for purchase."

Werk does not totally disregard the female family. Only the breeder can do that. Because a person buys a garden rake does not necessarily mean they will have a garden. Use the tool for its intended purpose and you might have a winner.

Here is an article discussing the pitfalls of nicks.

http://www.thoroughbredreview.com/nicking.htm

The best I can say if you use the nick is to validate it. Some nicks are hocus pocus and others quite real.

JonR

[griff]

Thanks, I really appreciate the positive input.

I am, however, still confused with the % thing; i.e., we have a filly with an A++ 204% and are looking at a Valid Appeal -Dispersal potentail cross with a A++ 23636%.

Does a A++ 23636% WERK have 10 times the potential as a A++ 204% WERK.

I understand in some cases the data base may be too small to be meaningful and that you must add the inportance of the broodmare yourself. However, this does seem to be good tool to use with other tools in selecting stallions and I'd really like to know what the difference between an A++ 204% and an A++ 23636% might indicate.

Again, thaks to all who made a positive input.

griff

[ragsdaj1]

Thanks, I really appreciate the positive input.

Does a A++ 23636% WERK have 10 times the potential as a A++ 204% WERK.

griff

Griff, according to the chart an A++ should not have a 204% variant. It should be 1501 or higher. What is the mare and sire names you are looking at. If you are getting a A++ 204 that probably will require a call or email to werk.


JonR