Such a sore loser, Sam...no matter what piss poor SC numbers I offer, you defend him. Charles Manson would have done well having you as an attorney.
Giant's Causeway has 29% winners out of one of the finest book of mares in the world. Um...would I like a piece of GC with a stat like that? Maybe if declaring bankruptcy is a New Year's resolution. Jackass!!!
Freud is outshining GC at a $10,000 fee. He's got 58% starters (compared to 59% of GC), 34% winners (better than GC), and $37,000 average/starter (compared to $49,000 average/starter for GC). And Freud does have an AEI that outweighs his CI, so he is imporving mares...although that stat means nothing to you, so I should overlook it. There's NO comparison in books of mares between the two, but if I want to get a horse to the races, it looks like Freud is a much safer investment. Chances are that Freud will never "hit the Home Run" with a foal, but how many had GC hit when you look at the incredible support he's been given? For Pete's sake - Noble Causeway is still listed in his top earners list. LOL!!!
I'll agree that $50,000 is a reasonable fee for GC, and if Tabor and Company ever selected mares that actually nick with him, his numbers would be better...or, maybe? He's been given some of the finest producing mares in the world and has not lived up to expectations by any means. Maybe in Europe, he'll start to shine on the turf with some runners...but it ain't gonna happen here with dirt stock. And that 2.10 AEI must be a tough sell this year - I'm not sure what the private contracts on GC are this year, but it looks like the days of $300,000 are over.
How many sons of SC should be on any top 100 list? Hmmm...considering the families that SC's sons carry, why not a ton of them? Is there a top family in the world that hasn't been invaded by Storm Cat? And so few replicated?
Exploit
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Rokeby Forever
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Hi Kal...very well written. I don't agree with 100% of your argument, but there's much I do agree with.
Actually, I remember rooting for Alydar against Affirmed (maybe ONE day Alydar will win that Belmont photo? Grrr!!!), remembering Seattle Slew's poor start in the KY Derby, and Ruffian breaking down....so I'm probably as much an old fart as you. My statements about Peace Rules were simply to allude to the fact that I remember him as a 2 year old before Bobby Frankel got his hands on him. He's a horse I always liked - tough, classy, sound....I really hope he does well as a sire.
With stallions today getting so many mares without mare selection, I think AEI is important because it says, "Even with so many different mares being thrown at a stallion, he's still having success." Yes, a "big" horse or two can skew the AEI, but how many horses like Pioneering ever come up with a "big" horse and still have a good (or respectable) AEI? You can chart the nick patterns to see the strengths of any AEI, but I see it as a great tool with the lower end sires. Of course, I think it makes a sire like Cozzene outstanding! What other sire around has that many millionaires and top class runners out of the book of mares he's received over the years?
GC may well become a top broodie sire...he has every right to be with the blood that his daughters carry.
One thing that seems to get resounding agreement...there don't seem to be too many fans of the Magnier/Tabor/Smith braintrust. With that in mind:
Chapel Royale got, what...225 mares in his first year? Now, if he gets 100 starters and 40 winners in his first crop, there's a good chance he'll sire a good one or two along the way. Based on that, I suppose his stud fee will balloon to $30,000 in no time...much like Johannesburg's did. So, I won't totally conclude that it's sons of SC polluting the planet - Coolmore seems to do plenty of it with any sire line you can think of.
Actually, I remember rooting for Alydar against Affirmed (maybe ONE day Alydar will win that Belmont photo? Grrr!!!), remembering Seattle Slew's poor start in the KY Derby, and Ruffian breaking down....so I'm probably as much an old fart as you. My statements about Peace Rules were simply to allude to the fact that I remember him as a 2 year old before Bobby Frankel got his hands on him. He's a horse I always liked - tough, classy, sound....I really hope he does well as a sire.
With stallions today getting so many mares without mare selection, I think AEI is important because it says, "Even with so many different mares being thrown at a stallion, he's still having success." Yes, a "big" horse or two can skew the AEI, but how many horses like Pioneering ever come up with a "big" horse and still have a good (or respectable) AEI? You can chart the nick patterns to see the strengths of any AEI, but I see it as a great tool with the lower end sires. Of course, I think it makes a sire like Cozzene outstanding! What other sire around has that many millionaires and top class runners out of the book of mares he's received over the years?
GC may well become a top broodie sire...he has every right to be with the blood that his daughters carry.
One thing that seems to get resounding agreement...there don't seem to be too many fans of the Magnier/Tabor/Smith braintrust. With that in mind:
Chapel Royale got, what...225 mares in his first year? Now, if he gets 100 starters and 40 winners in his first crop, there's a good chance he'll sire a good one or two along the way. Based on that, I suppose his stud fee will balloon to $30,000 in no time...much like Johannesburg's did. So, I won't totally conclude that it's sons of SC polluting the planet - Coolmore seems to do plenty of it with any sire line you can think of.
halo wrote:Jane, you ignorant slut....
Seems that line should fit in here somewhere...
I thought about using it, but even that character had more brains that our newest attention whore. Right now, I'm wondering if he isn't a sock for some other attention whore we don't see anymore. He's too coherent to be Ballymoss, but his being Whirlaway is not out of the realm of possibility.
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Rokeby Forever
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There is just too much to comment on; I'm trying to restrain myself. I will say one thing- you obviously have no CLUE who Shamardal was. Didn't do much after his juvenile season? He won the French Derby, French 2000 Guineas, and the St. James' Palace, all on the trot. Not too shabby.
As for Storm Cat winning the Pegasus, what crack are you smoking?
As for Storm Cat winning the Pegasus, what crack are you smoking?
Rokeby Forever wrote:His best 2 sons, First Samurai and Sharmardal, didn't do much after their juvenile seasons, did they? That's why GC's AEI stinks...as do most sons of Storm Cat. Storm Cat himself didn't set the world on fire after winning the Pegasus, now did he?
Your move, comrade....
ef wrote:There is just too much to comment on; I'm trying to restrain myself. I will say one thing- you obviously have no CLUE who Shamardal was. Didn't do much after his juvenile season? He won the French Derby, French 2000 Guineas, and the St. James' Palace, all on the trot. Not too shabby.
As for Storm Cat winning the Pegasus, what crack are you smoking?
Quit throwing inconvenient facts at him, ef. You'll only confuse him more. I have to admit, I loved the "Storm Cat winning the Pegasus" comment.. that was almost as good as him asking about Raging Fever's stallion numbers.. ignoring the fact that Raging Fever is a mare.
I'm tellin' ya... it's a troll.
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Rokeby Forever
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Rokeby Forever
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- Posts: 6684
- Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 4:52 pm
- Location: Reno, NV